Greatestgrammie Glider  77 Posts
I'm new on here and am seeking some feedback on what I am or am not doing right with my 2 new little girls.I tried to get some help from Glider Central and didn't get much assistance in
First off let me explain (as briefly as I can),I discovered Sugar Gliders when a Vendor at our yrly Fair came to town.I would go by and see them every time and as much as I could and I would ask a multitude of questions of the Vendor.When I went home at night I would sit on the computer til the wee hours of the morning doing research on Sugar Gliders so I had a fair idea of what I was getting into when I finally acquired the 2 girls I have now. I have acquired the Book Knowledge,it's the hands on that has me concerned.
I acquired them through Craigslist from what I would later find out is from the 2nd owner of these girls who were bought from the Vendor during our Fair.
By what the Vendor told me during my question sessions,these girls were about 7-11wks old in Sept so I'm assuming that they are now about 14-18wks old.
The house where I went to get these girls had a HUGE amount of stress. . . kept in a high traffic room around 3 kids under the age of 8,2 cats,3 dogs and 2 adults whom the Sugar Gliders were extremely aggressive towards as they reached into the cage to gather them up to send home with me. It is very apparent that neither of the 2 previous owners tried one thing in the way of bonding and that I am the first one to even try. In the possession of the 2 previous owners even not one of them had installed the heat rock for these little girls.
In my first days of trying to handle the girls,it is quite apparent that one of them is the "leader" and the other one is the "follower". The "follower" nips some but because she seems to be the lesser female she is somewhat shy. The "leader" is quite nippy and even bit hard enough a couple of times that she drew blood.
In my desperation I went on Glider Central to seek help.Suggestions were as usual. . it takes time,leave them alone for a few days to adjust to the new surroundings and be patient. Not much else in the 7 days I was on their website though I did ask for feedback to my daily postings of my progress with the new girls so I am leaving that website and hope to find more help here.
I DID get one suggestion that said to try the girls on some chicken/applesauce babyfood on my fingers to let the girls know that my fingers were "friendly". This poster called this "liquid gold" and let me tell you. . . IT IS just that.
Using this "lickety treat" has help me to manage the girls on a better level though the "leader" does still try to bite though I'm on to her now. . .LOL LOL
From day one,I've carried these little girls in their pouch for up to 4hrs aday.I've talked to the pouch,massaged it while talking to it and have even been able to stick my hand into the pouch to massage and talk but I always watch their demeanor to avoid bites. Their crabbing/hissing has all but stopped when I talk to and massage the pouch. There is very little if any posturing,crabbing or hissing when I stick my hand in the cage at night. They will even let me pet on them while they are eating.
I will entice them to come to the edge of the pouch with this "liquid gold" and they approach very readily. I can even coax them out of their cage at night to seek the "liquid gold" and at that time they will crawl around on the ground around my legs.
I NEVER,NEVER,NEVER approach the girls without announcing my presence and I always move slowly around their cage etc when I try to handle them though the "follower" at this time seems to be the only one who reluctantly lets me handle her.
I feed the girls the "Glider Grub" that they came with,I use the vitamins/mineral powder as directed and I give fruits/veggies though it appears that they prefer sweet potato and apple. They have refused banana,peanut butter and raisins. I have a Mango fruit for later this week. Just in the 9 days that I have had the girls I can see an improvement in their fur. . it now seems thicker/bushier tails so I can only assume I'm doing something right.
PLEASE,PLEASE,PLEASE. . . help me by giving me some feedback.IF I am doing something wrong I would rather change it now than to let it become a bad habit to break later.
THANKS In Advance,
Greatestgrammie
snusie Goofy Gorillatoes     USA 2962 Posts I think you're doing quite well. Trust me, it does take time, especially if they hadn't been handled and loved on before. You're taking the right approach; be patient. It all has to happen on glider time. Some gliders never will like to be held, but that doesn't mean they don't like you. It's just the wild that's still in them. You may want to consider getting a tent. When you're in the tent, they have to interact with you. Take some toys and treats, and let 'em run around. Many of us here have the Genji tent; it's awesome. Sets up in two seconds, and takes about fifteen seconds to fold up; stores under a chair. It's a little costly, about $54 with shipping; but it's a great bonding tool. Toss the heat rock. They just don't need it. http://www.sugarglider.com/glidergossip/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=23911
As mammals, they regulate their own temperature. The vendors sell them because typically when sold, the joeys are too young to do that. Also toss the glider grub. Research diets; from the Glider Gossip page you can select only threads related to diet. Gliders need protein, fruits and vegetables; the fresher, the better. Pellets are just not sufficient, and can cause physical damage as well. Gliders need moist food. The dry pellets can damage their mouths and possibly obstruct intestines as well. Just another way for the vendor to make a buck, telling the customer he needs to buy a year's worth of this useless stuff. Thank you for your questions, and your willingness to change anything you may be doing wrong. From what I read, you are doing everything right except using the vendor's unnecessary crap. Greatestgrammie Glider 77 Posts THANK GOD! a real answer that didn't take tooth pulling torture to get! I have read the ingredients on the box of protein food that came with these girls and IF in fact it does have what it says then I can't see it being all that bad for the girls. I've read the Leadbeaters Diet and the Taronga Zoo Diet and while I can justify the Taronga Zoo Diet,the Leadbeaters Diet doesn't seem really right because I can't get these girls to eat smushed hard boiled egg and I'm concerned about honey side effects associated with unusually high sugar glucose levels. With the exception of the protein feed pellets I want to try and stay with as much natural and unprocessed foods as possible. In only having these girls for only 9 days now I have tried treats of yellow squash,smushed hard boiled eggs,yogurt with no luck BUT they love applesauce,sweet potato,apples and small amounts of avacado. . . we are getting ready to partake of some Mango fruit in a few more days and I say in a few more days because I notice they would rather eat the treats vs their feed and I don't want them strictly on a fruit/veggie diet alone. I DO tend to agree with the Vendor whom I asked alot of questions of. . . to feed a heavy diet of crickets,meal worms,day old chicks or pinkies as recommended in the Taronga Zoo Diet I am afraid I would have a Sugar Glider who smells way too musky for my taste. I have to experiement with the girls as to what they need to be fed but for now,in just the 9 days I have had them I certainly see an improvement in their fur/tails and it is probably because I have them in my bedroom where there is less traffic and where it is relatively sedate. I disagree about the heat rock though. I had to figure out a way so that I could actively handle the girls and to dig them out from under a blanket/towel they weren't liking that so I now let them sleep in their pouch which is laying over their heat rock. When they have felt the need to get more warmth they crawl up closer onto the rock and when they get too hot they move away from the rock BUT never do they completely get away from the rock. They seem to be very very happy with the rock. As far as the tent goes,would it be possible to just use a blanket draped over my head and secured at the bottom to prevent escape? Again,I THANK you for your help. Anything else you can help me with will be greatly appreciated. Greatestgrammie Glider 77 Posts Not really until I threatened to get off GC and now the "feedback" is falling from the skies. I got more help or feedback in one response than I have in the whole week that I have been on GC and even at that NO ONE ever answered the questions I posed. What works for one does not always work for another. Thanks snusie Goofy Gorillatoes USA 2962 Posts The next best thing to a tent is to glider-proof a small room. Bathrooms work well. http://www.sugarglider.com/glidergossip/topic.asp?ARCHIVE=true&TOPIC_ID=9741
Once you're sure it's safe and there are no escape holes, take the gliders in and peel the pouch off of them. Be sure you've closed the commode seat lid and are sitting on it! They'll run around and play, climb up you, and just have fun. It may take two or even three visits before they really start playing, but they'll do it. Again, take some treats. Mine love to climb up the towels on the door, play hide-and-seek with each other and with me; we play Leaping Lizards where I stand in the center of the room and they jump from the window curtain to me, to the door, back to me ... over and over. Again, I really advise you to check out other diets and get rid of the pellets. One big issue with pellets is that they're dry. In the wild, gliders will use those long front teeth to scrape bark off a tree limb and lap up the sap, which is very nitritious -- and also very wet. They eat insects, small birds, flowers, and fruit when they can get it. A glider will press the food against the roof of his mouth to extract all the liquid, and then spit out the dry remains. I'm sure you've seen this in your glider's dish in the morning. With a dry, pelleted food, your glider is not able to do this. He has to chew and swallow, which can lead to two health issues. First, it will scratch the inside of his mouth; the scratch can easily get infected and lead to abcess, tooth loss, even death. Second, gliders don't produce large amounts of saliva; they're adapted to eating wet, juicy food. You or I, cats and dogs, do have lots of saliva to wet down our food and make it more easily digestible. There have been cases of gliders dying with impacted dry food in the intestine, causing a blockage. This seems to me like a terrible, painful way to die. So, nutritional value notwithstanding, I believe there are two reasons to avoid pellets, both based on your glider's anatomy. They simply aren't adapted to eat that kind of food. Greatestgrammie Glider 77 Posts OMG. . .what brilliant advice and something I had not thought of nor had been told until now. . . .What a GREAT bonding tool. See Tootles,I've gotten way more on this website in one day than a week on GC. I'll see what I can find about what is available in my area for replacing the pellet food because you ARE the first one to give me viable arguments. And yes I've seen some things in the food dish that I thought might be some oat flakes from the pellet. I'll examine closer. Snusie,you have been a relief and a God Send. I've got to leave for work but when I get off at 10:30 you can bet I'll be back to read anything further that you should post. Thank You and God Bless You suggieluvr Super Glider USA 394 Posts As far as a diet goes, you want to stay away from feeding meal worms all the time because they are high in fat. Crickets are better, and it's fun to watch them catch them when instinct takes over. A good source of calcium is extremely important to prevent HLP. There are 3 different diets that I hear of people using. HPW, BML, and a 50% protein, 25% fresh fruit, and 25% fresh veggie mix. These guys can be very picky eaters and change what they like from day to day. I don't have one out of 13 that likes the same thing everyday. Maybe they don't like the egg alone, but you can mix it in a blender with other things they do like. It is a trial and error to find out what they like. But if the pellets are all they have been given in the past, that is what they will choose. Pellet food is like ensure shakes to me. It will give you what you need, but won't sustain you. Variety is the key. Also try yogurt as a lickey treat. And most of all remember they are nocturnal, so maybe they crab because they are trying to sleep. I am not trying to be mean, just saying from my experience.
Greatestgrammie Glider 77 Posts I certainly have made the right move by deciding to come here from GC but wouldn't you know it,I let the GC Administrators know I wanted to resign my account with them and now I've got advice falling out of the sky from posters but not as good as the advise I've gotten on here in ONE DAY! ! ! I did get one good tip from a GC poster and that was to use the "liquid gold" to get the girls use to my fingers and it has worked like a champ and I feel like a Bum passing on another poster's receipe.. . this is her trophy to pass on. . GOD BLESS HER! On the matter of pieces of food being found when the Gliders suck out the moisture etc,I am seeing bits left in the feed bowl that resemble oatmeal flakes.I'll have to examine them better to see just what they are. A question about the crickets. . . how do I feed live crickets? Dont they get out of the Glider Cage rather quickly once they realize what is going on? Wouldn't meal worms. . alive or dead be a better source of protein? What about organically grown earthworms? A local pet store that prides themselves on being experts on most animal. .domestic or exotic and they are telling me to feed them some bird grains (not sure which kind cuz I found this to be an odd feed and I really didn't listen to them about this). They also tell me that I can feed Vienna Sausages. This too seems odd to me and not very orthodox. They also recommend feeding shrimp. This too seems odd to me. . . what say ya'll? Snusie,I'm sure that there is some good and sound advise from GC but I didn't feel like I was getting where I needed to be. Their web page in my opinion is extremely hard to navigate and since offering to resign my account I get advise. . some of which tells me that when I asked my question on what I may or may not be doing right about feeding I should have posted that on the diet forum and I didn't know this or the rules about this. I opened my account with asking my question on biting in the "I'm New" category and in no time at all I got shifted over to the "Bonding/Relationships" forum. In the beginning I thought I was making my posts/queries to the "I'm New" forum and don't know how I got shifted nor did I know/realize that I had to jump from forum to forum should I change my questions or include another topic in my question. Guide me as to what I need to do on this site and what I need to do in posing my questions etc. Am I OK to stay here for now or do I need to move to another "forum"? Either way,I find you to be an Uplifting Force in my new venture with my girls. THANKS GLIDER GOSSIP snusie Goofy Gorillatoes USA 2962 Posts Feeding live crickets: (click on the picture to enlarge.) 
Another option is, when you get a tent, to let the crickets loose in the tent. I do this usually on Saturday night/Sunday morning and the gliders go nuts hunting. 
Now this won't work if you're squeamish, as the crickets end up all over -- sometimes on you. I'll just toss it back onto the floor of the tent when that happens. Organically grown earthworms: if you're sure that they're organic, then try it. (Unfortunately, there's so much ground contamination everywhere that I wouldn't dig up worms from the garden.) Check this out: http://www.nagonline.net/Technical%20Papers/NAGFS00397Insects-JONIFEB24,2002MODIFIED.pdf
They seem to be fairly high in fat; so go easy with them. There's a chart here: http://www.triciaswaterdragon.com/diet.htm#content
Vienna sausages: absolutely not. Salt and fat! Shrimp are okay, but be sure they're thoroughly cooked. Even if you buy frozen pre-cooked shrimp, it's a good idea to steam them for a couple of minutes to be on the safe side. Bird seed: forget it. Now we do give our guys some sunflower seeds as a treat; some feed them with the shell, some without. Same with pumpkin seeds and other nuts, they're a good occasional treat but not to be given as a major food group. Either raw or roasted is okay, but be sure there's no salt. (A high-salt diet will lead to dehydration, which can kill a sugar glider in as little as a day.) Be careful with grains; one of the treatments for diarhhea is to feed a few flakes of uncooked oatmeal, so in a healthy glider it can cause constipation (though cooked it's okay, and part of some diets.) I give my guys a fingernail-sized piece of a granola bar from time to time. They like it! Finally, start posting your questions on the Sugar Glider forum. They'll get a lot more attention and a greater diversity of answers, and so you will get a much better overall picture. There are numerous members here who know a lot more than I do! snusie Goofy Gorillatoes USA 2962 Posts I wouldn't buy earthworms from Walmart or any bait store, unless they're raised on site. Then you'll want to see where they're raised, find out what they're fed, all that stuff. As Mollysmom said, the soil is pretty contaminated most places nowadays, especially near the big cities. My uncle had a worm farm once, years ago, in Wharton. It was pretty neat. I have a friend who's really into organic gardening, runs a landscape business; and she raises earthworms in a tub on her back porch. Those worms have never touched the ground, at least until she adds them to a garden. She uses the castings for fertilizer. It's great stuff! Anyway, if I were to feed earthworms, I would buy them from her. All they eat is her table scraps and dead leaves from her completely organic home. Mollysmom Goofy Gorillatoes MI, USA 2011 Posts Earthworms are a fabulous way to compost! Even city folks are doing that nowadays under their kitchen sinks! :-) I love that! I do not feed crickets for fear that my gliders will be exposed to aflatoxins. I am reluctant even with mealworms, unless I know the source and feel that I can trust the conditions they've been raised in. I know that Camille's a good egg, and she feeds her own critters her vita-mealies, so I'm comfortable with her worms. Heck, I even scrub the heck outta the fruits and veggies I'll give my fuzz butts! But, hey, there was a night not long ago that I only had a little, very lean steak--not enough to feed my family, but enough for the gliders. We were having an insanely busy night at our house, so naturally-- THE GLIDERS GOT THE STEAK, AND MY SKIN KIDS (AND MY HUSBAND AND I) HAD CEREAL AND TOAST!!! LOL! My kids were teasing me and laughing about this the other night. Glad they understand my priorities, aren't you?! Greatestgrammie Glider 77 Posts OH,this is what I bought to put Sand Crabs in when I gave them to my "adopted" grandson.Actually he was my best friends grandson whom they adopted at birth.His Grammie now Momma was too girly girly to let the little boy have dogs/cats etc so "pets" of the Aquatic mode seemed to be just what was inline. This would be the perfect solution on having/feeding crickets. THANKS SO MUCH ! ! ! I've tried the bathroom bonding thing but until I get all of the toenails clipped(don't have the Wodent Wheel yet) this won't work cuz they tend to hang on the bathroom carpet. Course that keeps them under control but really doesn't seem fair to them. As per Snusie's suggestion I have moved over to Glider Forum to ask any further questions. Right now I have posed my latest under Diet. THANKS TO EVERYONE THUS FAR FOR ALL OF YOUR REPLIES. . . . YOU GUYS ARE A MUCH FRIENDLIER AND HELPFUL BUNCH THAN THOSE ON GC.
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Needing some feedback. . . . . .
I agree, Snusie!
I consider mine lucky that I get them mealworms. They gross me out. I have to use the bamboo tongs to handle them. LOL
Of course the gliders got the steak! 
Anyone who would expect anything different has never lived with little guys. And I bet they loved it. 
