Sugar gliders are nocturnal animals. You need to know and fully understand the concept of "nocturnal" <b>BEFORE</b> you bring one into your home.

We often say and read - "if you can't afford a vet, you can't afford the pet."

But what does that mean in terms of an exotic, nocturnal animal?

It means that 1) <b>you need to have an exotic vet on call</b>. An exotic vet whom you have confirmed will see sugar gliders. You need to know that <i>exotic vets are more expensive than "regular" vets</i>. You need to have that money set aside WAY in advance. You NEED to have a Vet Fund.

And 2) <b>Nocturnal animals get sick at night.</b> Your <b>PRIMARY</b> sugar glider vet needs to be an <i>exotic vet who has a 24-hour practice</i>. You need to have the money for an exotic vet who is also an emergency vet - you've now tripled your vet expenses - and you need to <b>have that vet number on hand.</b>

Like all "prey animals" sugar gliders mask their illness. They are very good at it. By the time you know your sugar glider is sick - you are more than likely hours away from death.

I said <b>"Hours away from death."</b>

I didn't say "Things look really bad." I said <i><b>DEATH</b></i>. I'm not being over-dramatic. I'm not being mean. I'm telling the truth. The truth is that when your sugar glider is sick and you notice it is sick, it is almost DEAD.

DO NOT come onto a forum - any forum - and ask for advice or help. You don't have time. <b>Go to the vet. NOW.</b> Remember? That 24-hour emergency/exotic vet you found in advance and have on call? Remember? The very expensive vet that you have a vet fund in advance to pay for. THAT vet. Call that vet, and go there.

If I see you on the forum, I'm going to "be mean" and tell you that your sugar glider is going to die. Because sometimes the truth is "mean."

I agree with you, I just hope before anyone decides to "be mean" that we at least check the post count of the person posting. I only say that because I found this forum when I needed help after I got my gliders from my mom. Luckily, mine weren't sick, but I did get great information that I needed.

I'm only saying that someone who is in "panic" mode because something is really wrong with a glider that they purchased may come here desperate for answers. Humans buy on impulse, my dog is a product of that.

If someone is told by <s>Pocket Pets</s>, I mean, a company selling gliders that they are no maintenance, the owner may not already have a "vet fund" set aside or even know that sugar gliders require an exotic vet.

Panic mode or not. Vet fund or not. The truth is that if you find your glider lying on the cage floor, listless and cold - it is going to die.

Too many times I've seen that, and the owner is told "Go to a VET!" and they argue with such intensity that "There isn't an exotic vet." or "I don't have the money." or "I will wait until morning."

Sorry - regardless of what that person was told by a Mill Broker, I'm going to tell them straight up, "If you don't go to a vet tonight, your glider is going to die."

I'm not going to bash them for their purchasing decisions, or their dietary decisions, or bash them at all. But I will tell them the cold truth - their glider is dying.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by AshleyJ</i>
<br />I agree with you, I just hope before anyone decides to "be mean" that we at least check the post count of the person posting. I only say that because I found this forum when I needed help after I got my gliders from my mom. Luckily, mine weren't sick, but I did get great information that I needed.

I'm only saying that someone who is in "panic" mode because something is really wrong with a glider that they purchased may come here desperate for answers. Humans buy on impulse, my dog is a product of that.

If someone is told by <s>Pocket Pets</s>, I mean, a company selling gliders that they are no maintenance, the owner may not already have a "vet fund" set aside or even know that sugar gliders require an exotic vet.

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I agree, there are ways to give factual information in a kind, caring way, I never see reason for meanness.

Otherwise, very good advise given by Valkyremome.

To be honest, it is not being "mean" when we are telling someone that their glider is going to die if you do not get them to the vet as soon as possible. It is the truth...if someone posts that their glider is not moving, lying at the bottom of the cage, won't eat, won't drink, etc. then the truth is that if you do not get the glider to a vet immediately, it will not make it until morning. Why dance around it, trying to sound nice, when if you "scare" them by saying, your glider is going to die if you do not get them to a vet, then maybe just maybe they will make the effort to get them to the vet. I understand if someone comes on here saying, "quick, I need the number for a vet consult", but not, "why is my glider like this, what should I do". The answer will always be, get them to the vet immediately. If someone doesn't want to listen to that advice, then so be it, but do not come on here asking for sympathy when the glider does pass. Sorry, if that seems callous, but when you tell someone to get to the vet, and they choose not to, then there will be no sympathy from me. I would drive HOURS to find a vet if I absolutely had to, so really there is no excuse. If that is rude, so be it...I honestly don't care at this point. I totally agree with this topic...an impulse buy is just that, but once someone starts doing their research, they will find out pretty quickly what needs to be done to take care of a glider properly.

ETA: I guess I shouldn't say "scare" because it really isn't a scare tactic per se, just trying to get people to see that get them to the vet and don't waste your time trying to figure out why they are lying there on the bottom of the cage. We are not vets, we cannot diagnose...we can give advice on things such as bonding, diet, etc. but when it comes down to it, if it is something out of the norm for your glider or something very serious, then you should always consult with a vet. There...off my soapbox now!

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by valkyriemome</i>
<br />Panic mode or not. Vet fund or not. The truth is that if you find your glider lying on the cage floor, listless and cold - it is going to die.

Too many times I've seen that, and the owner is told "Go to a VET!" and they argue with such intensity that "There isn't an exotic vet." or "I don't have the money." or "I will wait until morning."

Sorry - regardless of what that person was told by a Mill Broker, I'm going to tell them straight up, "If you don't go to a vet tonight, your glider is going to die."

I'm not going to bash them for their purchasing decisions, or their dietary decisions, or bash them at all. But I will tell them the cold truth - their glider is dying.
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Love it. Your not mean, just straight up honest.

Mean is letting your pet die because you were to lazy or ignorant to do the right thing.

And that's why I love Scott and Alden sometimes honesty will save a life. If you are broke don't buy a pet of any kind. If you don't have a vet planned out for emergencies GET ONE! And don't say you can't find one. The nearest emergency exotic vet is 2 hrs away from me but if something happens I will be taking a road trip.

Also just want to point out that if you do run into a situation where you don't have a vet or can't find one, we'll do our best to help you find one! A lot of times, there aren't nearly as many people around at night so as stated repeatedly, be prepared ahead of time if humanly possible.

I spent one Christmas Eve in an emergency vet hospital with one of mine. It absolutely happens at night most of the time.

Great post Alden I'd add that they should secure Carecredit or have some kind of credit card back-up in case funds are depleted. Thats just me though. I only wish posts like this could be always on top for anyone and everyone. Sadly, they seem to fall off. I think Alden, since you started the thread, you should bump it every time it falls off so it stays there available.

This looks like it may need to be a sticky thread

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Omis n Kais g-ma</i>
<br />Great post Alden I'd add that they should secure Carecredit or have some kind of credit card back-up in case funds are depleted. Thats just me though. I only wish posts like this could be always on top for anyone and everyone. Sadly, they seem to fall off. I think Alden, since you started the thread, you should bump it every time it falls off so it stays there available.
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We can also bookmark it too

Yup, happened at night for me.

Also, one thing about emergency vets - you show up with your pet and 9x out of 10 they wont turn you away as long as you make a case for yourself. Emergency people WANT to help and clinics WANT to get paid. Many of the simple things that would help stabilize a glider until a consult can be arranged via the phone they do regularly for cats/dogs. What is soooo important about 'GET TO A VET' is even if they have never seen a sugar glider before they have access to the medical resources (machines, drugs and so-on) that could save your baby. Your glider is better off with fluids, oxygen, PAIN relief and heat packs at a vet waiting for the Doctors to figure out what a sugar glider is, than at home where it can't receive any help. Don't call, GO!

Here are some vet links as well. There's no time like the present if you haven't found a vet already:

http://www.sugarglider.com/vets.asp

http://thesweetspot.forumotion.net/f3-trusted-vets-listed-by-state

http://www.sugargliderhelp.com/links/pages/Sugar_Glider_Vet_Database/index.html

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Rowangel</i>
<br />Yup, happened at night for me.

Also, one thing about emergency vets - you show up with your pet and 9x out of 10 they wont turn you away as long as you make a case for yourself. Emergency people WANT to help and clinics WANT to get paid. Many of the simple things that would help stabilize a glider until a consult can be arranged via the phone they do regularly for cats/dogs. What is soooo important about 'GET TO A VET' is even if they have never seen a sugar glider before they have access to the medical resources (machines, drugs and so-on) that could save your baby. Your glider is better off with fluids, oxygen, PAIN relief and heat packs at a vet waiting for the Doctors to figure out what a sugar glider is, than at home where it can't receive any help. Don't call, GO!
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Good point! I like the way you said this

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by prettyinpink5808</i>
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Rowangel</i>
<br />Yup, happened at night for me.

Also, one thing about emergency vets - you show up with your pet and 9x out of 10 they wont turn you away as long as you make a case for yourself. Emergency people WANT to help and clinics WANT to get paid. Many of the simple things that would help stabilize a glider until a consult can be arranged via the phone they do regularly for cats/dogs. What is soooo important about 'GET TO A VET' is even if they have never seen a sugar glider before they have access to the medical resources (machines, drugs and so-on) that could save your baby. Your glider is better off with fluids, oxygen, PAIN relief and heat packs at a vet waiting for the Doctors to figure out what a sugar glider is, than at home where it can't receive any help. Don't call, GO!
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Good point! I like the way you said this
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Sad that you speak from so much experience. But you are a case-in-point, Rowangel. If you'd sat on your heels, or called and been told "No" and believed them - you'd have lost your adorable boy. You are an example for all of us!

Not to sound like I am advocating treating an animal but having an emergency kit wouldn't hurt. Ecollar, heat pack etc. I jut one of these and the heat pack is not reusable but an awesome idea to keep your glider warm during vet transport.

http://www.thegliderinitiative.org/tgistore.htm

Note that some of this stuff you can not buy, you need to get a vet to give it to you.

I have never had an emergency vet turn me down. A few years back I rescued a ferret and I live in California, he was really sick. I actually called the emergency vet and they had no problem treating him. Emergency people want to help animals maybe even more so then some vets(from my experience) and like Rowangel said clinics want money. Its kind of rare that they turn you down

I found an emergency contact list on Sugargliderhelp.com. I am printing it out to keep on hand in case of emergency. Is there any other lists anywhere? Thank you for bringing this needed preparation to my attention. I pray I never have to use it.

Yep, if you click on the second link I posted, there are emergency contacts there as well. I think they are almost all the same people as on the one you have though.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by valkyriemome</i>

Sad that you speak from so much experience. But you are a case-in-point, Rowangel. If you'd sat on your heels, or called and been told "No" and believed them - you'd have lost your adorable boy. You are an example for all of us!
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There were a couple times when if we had 'waited' I know we would have lost Casey.

What frustrates me are people who say 'well, this is happening, but he seems ok...I can't afford a vet does he REALLY need to go in?'

If this was a human family member, would it even be up for discussion??? You find away to make it work! Most clinics have payment plans available, so their really is no excuse IMO.

I completely agree.

I am a fairly new glider mama and this is a no-brainer to me. When I got my second boy, my first boy got diahhrea. As soon as I noticed this, I quickly got some Pedyalite into him and called the exotic vet. They saw me within 30 minutes - luckly I have an exotic vet near me. Not only did I take Suggs to get checked, get fluids and antibiotics, I also had Albert (the new boy) checked out as well just in case. Everything was fine, negative fecals on both, and Suggie might have had an UTI; he was 5% dehydrated and the vet sub-qd 8cc of liquid into him. After a week of antibiotics, a few days of extra liquids fed by mama, he is fine and dandy. It was $250 for that visit but well worth the money to know my boys are allright and will thrive with me for many years to come.

Thanks Alden!
As I said in another thread, (and was not well received ) it doesn't matter if the e-vet is experienced with gliders. If you GO with the consult list in hand they WILL see your glider. I have never heard of anyone being turned away because they showed up with that list and the e-vet said they won't help. So the excuse of "there is no e-vet that will see a sugar glider" doesn't fly. Now, if you are calling to FIND one AHEAD of time they may say that they don't see them. However, show up with the sick glider and a way for them to access the help that they need to treat it and they will help. Also, e-vets all know how to do sub-q fluids (I mean that's something that many owners know how to do so it's really a no brainer) and many times that is the difference between a glider living long enough to get treatment and dying.
When you are looking for an e-vet and they say that they don't see gliders ASK if they will let you come in and show them the vet consult list. Many vets that don't see gliders WILL see them if they feel that they are not going in blind.

If you know how to use one.. its also a good idea to keep a saline drip handy :)

Yes, telling someone their glider will die is not rude. But, should you tell them HOW the glider will die (slowly and possibly painfully) then you shall for all time become a monster worthy of being called names and deemed evil on all forums.
:)

OR, you could just be right and speaking from way more experience than you wish.

Never call an emergency vet and ask if they see sugar gliders. Most of them will say "no." It makes no sense to call ahead. If your child were injured, would you call the emergency room to see if they treat broken arms or constipation?

I have had 4 personal experiences with receiving treatment from emergency vets who SAID that they don't treat gliders. I'm working on a write up for TSS about how to approach this situation, but it is not too different from what Lori posted above. Help is always available to you if you really want it. ;)

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Rowangel</i>
<br /><blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by valkyriemome</i>
<br />I'm not going to bash them for their purchasing decisions, or their dietary decisions, or bash them at all. But I will tell them the cold truth - their glider is dying.
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Love it. Your not mean, just straight up honest.
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i agree completely. i have seen you do this very thing, Val, and i don't think it is mean at all. It is the simple fact of the matter.

When you see a doctor and he recommends a treatment or procedure, he is required by law to tell you the risks and benefits of the treatment as well as what you can expect to happen if you choose not to have the treatment. This is called "informed consent." Giving someone the facts, "If you do not get your glider to a vet ASAP it is likely that your pet will not survive the night," is not mean or cruel. It is attempting to give someone the essential information they need to make the choice to get their glider treatment or not. Ultimately that decision is up to them, but not saying, "Your glider will die," is withholding vital information that may help them make the decision more clearly and quickly.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Rowangel</i>
<br />Your glider is better off with fluids, oxygen, PAIN relief and heat packs at a vet waiting for the Doctors to figure out what a sugar glider is, than at home where it can't receive any help. Don't call, GO!
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i think this is a great point, Rowangel! We get into the mindset that we should ONLY take our babies to an exotics vet who has experience with sugar gliders, and there are good reasons to have that policy. But in an emergency situation, any vet should be able to at least do more than you can do at home to try to stabilize your baby.

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Something_To_Believe_In</i>
<br />Yes, telling someone their glider will die is not rude. But, should you tell them HOW the glider will die (slowly and possibly painfully) then you shall for all time become a monster worthy of being called names and deemed evil on all forums.
:)

OR, you could just be right and speaking from way more experience than you wish.

Never call an emergency vet and ask if they see sugar gliders. Most of them will say "no." It makes no sense to call ahead. If your child were injured, would you call the emergency room to see if they treat broken arms or constipation?

I have had 4 personal experiences with receiving treatment from emergency vets who SAID that they don't treat gliders. I'm working on a write up for TSS about how to approach this situation, but it is not too different from what Lori posted above. <b>Help is always available to you if you really want it.</b> ;)
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Exactly.

Okay, I know it is here somewhere but could someone please post the vets and their cont info for other vets to contact for consults? I don't have it printed up but want it.
PLZ and Thanx