quote:

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Originally posted by kyro298

So, these are ALL run by the same person?

www.facebook.com/SGliders/info This one says that this is run by the same people that run the next one (SGAA). Pretty sure Kazko didn't OK that! LOL

http://sgaa.info/

www.facebook.com/GliderGossipFB/info

THIS one says (and I quote)

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*im not the owner of GG. this page was made with the permission of the owner kazko*

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Is that a true statement for GliderGossipFB or was that for the SGliders one?

Please, contact him and clarify all of these pages so he knows exactly what is being directly correlated with this forum. He knows of ONE...the first one I linked to, which clearly states is run by the same people that run the SGAA forum. Katie, if you aren't the one that runs SGAA, who does, since they are the same people that run the GG page you say you have permission for and run? Who else is admin on the Glider Gossip page?

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Kyro, I think you are trying to group them when they aren't the same ;)

www.facebook.com/SGliders/info and https://www.facebook.com/SGliderC
ARE linked at the SGliders/info page didn't want people to keep posting classifieds,

but

www.facebook.com/GliderGossipFB/info
Is Glider Gossips facebook page

and

http://sgaa.info/
is an information website ALSO linked to the sugar glider aa forum but NOT linked to Glider Gossip

;)

I'm asking for clarification because it clearly states SGliders and SGAA are run by the SAME people. I can assure you that Kazko does NOT know that. I also didn't even reference the one for Sugar Glider ads so I'm definitely not lumping that in.

Yes those are run by the same people as far as I can tell anyway...

I guess what I don't understand is: Are you upset that the Glider Gossip facebook page and the Sgliders facebook page are run by the same people when Kazko gave permission for her to make a Glider Gossip page?

**Khigh made SG AA and made SGlider/info, Kazko made GG, and Shadow made GG fb page with expressed ok from Kazko...shadow is a mod or maker on all...**

From what I am reading he gave her permission because he didn't have the time or want to deal with it, right?

I'm sure if the problem is that they are run by the same people and he doesn't want GG to be in any way shape or form connected (with little bitty thread might I add) to SG AA then shadow would gladly give him the GG FB page ;)

These might be easier to read:

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Originally posted by CountrynCrafty

Yes those are run by the same people as far as I can tell anyway...

I guess what I don't understand is: Are you upset that the Glider Gossip facebook page and the Sgliders facebook page are run by the same people when Kazko gave permission for her to make a Glider Gossip page?

**Khigh made SG AA, Kazko made GG, Rachael made SGlider/info and Shadow made GG fb page with expressed ok from Kazko...shadow is a mod or maker on all...**

From what I am reading he gave her permission because he didn't have the time or want to deal with it, right?

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I know who made what. ;)

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I'm sure if the problem is that they are run by the same people and he doesn't want GG to be in any way shape or form connected (with little bitty thread might I add) to SG AA then shadow would gladly give him the GG FB page ;)

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MAYBE Katie should contact Kazko so it's all crystal clear who's running what, what's associated with this site and WHO ALL is running it. She was also given permission before she had been banned, by the way, since you seem to want to get into detail.

rachel doesnt even go to SGAA she is busy with other things. and khigh is not connected to the SG FB page but rachel decided to make it the forum for the SG page. she had a different forum a while back but it wasnt all that active.
when you like a page on FB it just means that its a page you think is neat and stuff. should i delete all the liked pages??? most of the people who end up liking the GG page most likely come from the SG FB page and you cant stop another page from liking your page i think.
do you only want there to be one thing on FB for GG? i can go and delete one if that will help things.

Katie, in case I haven't been perfectly clear, WHO ALL runs SGAA and WHO ALL runs SGliders (SINCE THEY ARE RUN BY THE SAME PEOPLE) and WHO ALL runs Glider Gossip FB?

YES, I'm pretty sure there should only be ONE GG Facebook page, as that is the assumption Kazko had in mind. If you want to be 100% sure, I HIGHLY suggest contacting Kazko.

kyro- I didn't know that she was given permission before she was banned, but since she's back now doesn't that mean she still has that permission?



Shadow-To me this all seems too complicated and for the sake of not arguing anymore I would personally just delete the GG facebook page. If Kazo (or whatever admin) wants to make a facebook page then I'd say let them do it ;)

It hasn't been discussed with Kazko since then so for the 4th, 5th, 6th time...I would suggest you contact Kazko, Katie. If he's OK with it, GREAT! I was asking simple questions to clarify. That's all!

Oh and if Katie wants to go shut down Facebook pages because someone asked for clarification and to make it "easier", that's certainly her call. NO ONE is arguing. My simple questions are being avoided, which I guess are too complicated?

Pretty sure everyone is allowed to know who runs the pages associated with this forum.

ok ill do that when i have a moment. im removing all the likes on the page and will suggest to rachel to remove the GG page from the SG FB page. : ) ill also delete the group or page later.

i did not avoid your questions i answered them all.

I guess I'll ask again because I sure don't see who ALL runs these pages.

quote:

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Originally posted by kyro298

Katie, in case I haven't been perfectly clear, WHO ALL runs SGAA and WHO ALL runs SGliders (SINCE THEY ARE RUN BY THE SAME PEOPLE) and WHO ALL runs Glider Gossip FB?

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I'm assuming you chose to delete as opposed to discuss it with Kazko? Why now? Because I asked for clarification?

quote:

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Originally posted by shadow

ok ill do that when i have a moment. im removing all the likes on the page and will suggest to rachel to remove the GG page from the SG FB page. : ) ill also delete the group or page later.

i did not avoid your questions i answered them all.

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i said ill talk to kazko later. i removed the likes to remove the problem for now. i can always re like the pages.
running SGAA is a group effort there are lots of admins and mods. and i think CnC explained it well. you will have to ask rachel for all the names on the SG FB page because i dont know all of them.
but now that i have removed the likes from the page is it still a problem?? but if its really needed ill type them all out.

ASK KAZKO IF IT'S A PROBLEM!

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Originally posted by kyro298

ASK KAZKO IF IT'S A PROBLEM!

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and i said i will later its almost 10pm and im getting tired. so ill do it tomorrow evening most likely since i babysit/pet sit during the day.

I know you said you would but yet you're still asking ME so I'm getting tired of giving the same answer repeatedly. All I wanted was to know how they were all connected, who all was running them and if Kazko knew. You took it upon yourself to make "something" (I have no clue what?) "easier" and to solve some "problem". Do what you want, Katie. The entire SIMPLE issue is that Kazko deserves the courtesy of knowing what is being associated with his forum.

quote:

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Originally posted by kyro298

I know you said you would but yet you're still asking ME so I'm getting tired of giving the same answer repeatedly. All I wanted was to know how they were all connected, who all was running them and if Kazko knew. You took it upon yourself to make "something" (I have no clue what?) "easier" and to solve some "problem". Do what you want, Katie. The entire SIMPLE issue is that Kazko deserves the courtesy of knowing what is being associated with his forum.

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whoops sorry lol like i said im getting tired so my brain isnt working that well. i removed the likes for now until its decided if its a problem or not. i just never really gave it any thought since it had never been a problem in the past.
guess ill type all the names.

This is ridiculous. I AM THE OWNER of the Sugar Glider page on fb. Linda and Amber are co-owners and shadow and lisa are mods. Amber, shadow, and i think lisa do the SGAA. WE HAVE NO AFFILIATION WITH GG. I didn't even know about GG when i started the sugar glider page like 2-3yrs ago. How about we stop acting like 5y/o fighting over NOTHING. It's a goddamn facebook page. Argue over something more productive. I do what I can w/ SGAA every now and then, but I'm good to just manage my own page and plan a wedding at the same time while keeping down a job and so much more that I'm not going to even go into detail about, bc I'm sure no one really cares. Still. Get a life. There is no affiliation at all w/ GG from the sugar glider page. We have 2 sister pages, and those are for classifieds and the other is for spamming pictures of gliders, and I am not owner of those, I believe Amber is. That is all I am going to say on this topic

Since I'm clearly being too complex here, I'll be more simple and repost my same post as before...

All I wanted was to know how they were all connected, who all was running them and if Kazko knew. You took it upon yourself to make "something" (I have no clue what?) "easier" and to solve some "problem". Do what you want, Katie. The entire SIMPLE issue is that Kazko deserves the courtesy of knowing what is being associated with his forum.

Sue me.

Who's fighting again? Oh yeah, I forgot, questioning something or asking for clarification equals fighting in the glider world.

I'll go get a life...if only mine were as fulfilled and important as yours.... *sigh*. I'll see if I can manage to find a life aside from running my own business, helping my husband run his, being a full time soccer mom and full time dance mom going to multiple practices weekly, driving 2 hours each way on the in between nights, games, tournaments and competitions on weekends, running the new organization we started after the wildfires, attending fundraising events weekly, helping care for my father in law and "so much more that I'm not even going to go into detail about". Thanks for taking time out of your super busy life to make an attempt to clarify what you feel is "nothing". I realize how painful this must be for those being asked to clarify something that could have been very simple.

Oh yeah, and Katie took it upon herself to link to your FB page on the very first post here so why wouldn't people think its associated with GG when the thread is titled letting people know GG is on Facebook?

That's rhetorical, by the way, for those who think they need to post some defensive response.

Wow Kyro you just sound so much more busy than me. How on earth do you find time to be such a brat? In between telling everyone what you do and/or clearly ignoring Katie. Our page liked another page. That was the only connection b/t the 2. That's all, but don't worry. The Sugar Glider page no longer "likes" GG. Please go back to your busy life. I got this under control ;D

Clearly.

quote:

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Originally posted by rinny08

This is ridiculous. I AM THE OWNER of the Sugar Glider page on fb. Linda and Amber are co-owners and shadow and lisa are mods. Amber, shadow, and i think lisa do the SGAA. WE HAVE NO AFFILIATION WITH GG. I didn't even know about GG when i started the sugar glider page like 2-3yrs ago. How about we stop acting like 5y/o fighting over NOTHING. It's a goddamn facebook page. Argue over something more productive. I do what I can w/ SGAA every now and then, but I'm good to just manage my own page and plan a wedding at the same time while keeping down a job and so much more that I'm not going to even go into detail about, bc I'm sure no one really cares. Still. Get a life. There is no affiliation at all w/ GG from the sugar glider page. We have 2 sister pages, and those are for classifieds and the other is for spamming pictures of gliders, and I am not owner of those, I believe Amber is. That is all I am going to say on this topic

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And you are who? Trying to get all the names sorted out here.

i am the owner of the sugar glider page on facebook. My name is Rachel, and that's all I'm saying on here

i contacted kazko like on the 25th and have not gotten a response from him. i decided to make a new thread just so i can put it all in the first post.

You know what...I actually agree - THIS IS RIDICULOUS. But not because I think anyone is acting like a 5 year old for asking. Members here - ESPECIALLY members with years of tenure and over 15k posts MOST certainly have the right to ask about "other" pages or sites out there affiliated with the GG site and name but not ran by the owners (and I am not negating the permission given so long ago). This is ESPECIALLY true if that person is generally accepted and trusted as a senior member that has GG's best interest in the forefront of her exchanges across this site and several others as Kyro does. I am sorry - but Kyro has VESTED into this site and has every right to ask for understanding. Quite frankly - any of you may have clout on Facebook or otherwise...but here - she has it and I will remind you that you logged in to GG to respond...not FB.

I personally see a conflict of interest with Katie running the page and I think that is part of what people might be feeling or putting out there. I would have a problem with a leader on any other forum running anything affiliated with GG. The affiliations (even if now absolved) are not sound with the affiliations of this site. Do you think that GC has someone that is a "leader" on other pages or forums running their facebook page? Nope. NO way. It's rare to find holistic objectivity needed to effectively run both.

I will also go out on a limb and say what no one else is saying - NO MATTER what you all say - the SGAA "took off" after the banning of two of their leaders got involved. In addition to that, while Katie certainly has not done anything "recently" that I am aware of that would warrant re-banning - she ABSOLUTELY used GG as a recruiting ground for SGAA, other pages, chats, etc. Call me crazy...but having a person that has recently used the forum for personal gain and giving them access as the marketing point, manager, and leader of a social media networking vehicle...is asinine.

Get mad if you want to on my response - but I am just stating the facts. You want to know why it's a big deal? There you go. There is muddy muddy water here and that is a huge part of why the general feeling has been one of validation and seeking understanding. I can't change the past - I just know how it affects today and NOT ONE OF YOU can ignore that.

I am astounded that we're getting this bent out of shape over this sort of topic. Why can't we get this heated over mill breeders? Why can't we get this heated over all the sugar gliders filling up the rescues, that desperately need a home?

First of all--and let me be very clear about this--I am not taking sides. I really don't care about politics of any sort.

I am, however, worried about what the new people here are going to think. They come here seeking answers and they have to sift through all this drama? They will probably go elsewhere for help, or worse, try and figure it out on their own, or just believe the lies PPP have told them. Is that what we want?

I believe we are here on this forum to help each other, not to throw poo.

On the topic of forgiveness, if one truly believes such things, learn to let go. If you constantly bring up the past, then obviously, there is a grudge and not forgiveness.

One has absolutely nothing to do with the other. People get so "bent out of shape" because some stick their noses where they don't belong, some don't know what's causing the issue, some don't like to be honest, some don't like to answer simple questions...there's a whole host of reasons for getting bent out of shape.

People don't get as worked up over mill breeders? Really? Give me a break.

If a thread gets heated once in a while, people are just going to have to deal with it. I do not care if people think they do or don't know what's worth questioning or "arguing" over. I don't live in a perfect world where hundreds of strangers interact with zero conflict. Never will. If someone thinks this is so out of line and terrible, flag it. Maybe it would make someone either respond or this crap can get locked finally. Pretty sure I said if Kazko doesn't care, either do I.

This is where we might disagree a little bit Rebecca - BUT, I want you to know that I love you OODLES and BUNCHES no matter if we always agree or not. (and I mean that, I am not being sarcastic.)

I think the reason that some of us are bent out of shape is because this IS important. You talk about the livelihood of this site and being here for new people - this is one reason why the tensions are high about this. It's important that the mission, vision, and values (yeah, I got all corporate) of Sugarglider.com are protected and pushed forward in the way that the owners would want and in a way that is most conducive to helping new owners. And it's important that we protect that. With this situation - my position is very clear. It may appear that I am being "nasty" but I'm not, I am saying what no one else was saying but a good number of us were thinking. Stating the facts and being direct - but certainly not "mean for the sake of grudges or being mean". Being that this is a community, it's only fair to consider the facts together where we can. I know (for a fact), I am not alone in this assessment. And on a note of dissension - no one can argue that this site has had a DRAMATIC decrease in "drama" related posts over the past several months. GG has made excellent strides here. We are getting better - but there will be times when we get passionate about topics and there will be disagreements. I would challenge someone to show me a forum out there that does not ever have disagreements. Not gonna happen. The unfortunate thing here is that people are taking "passion" and misinterpreting it for "drama". If you have not considered the bigger picture of impact - then you might not understand this or why it is important. I encourage anyone reading to do just that.

Another reason why this is so important is because FB CAN drive traffic away from this site. I can tell you now - people are posting questions that could be posted on GG on FB. If there is going to be another venue like that - we need to carefully calibrate the impact to GG. Putting a topic here - saves it for new people to refer upon forever and a day - on FB...not so much. The value of the long term searchable learning is lost on FB. I know that Kaz is already considering options and ways to look at that issue - but part of that IS systemic and it takes time to vet out. Part of the value of this site is having a long term archive and source for users to search on - we do not want to lose this kind of content.

As far as being passionate about mill breeders - oh we are. But we also know our limitations and many people feel that the mill breeder issue is much being than them. If we "truly" want to impact that - we have to go bigger, deeper, and get in to the core of the legal side and really campaign, lobby, and petition. If you were to search GG - I bet you will find there is a LOT of passion on mill breeding and for many years. And what can we do? Complain. Cry. Get really upset. But until someone or some organization is willing to take this to the "right" level...we are just talking and that makes people feel defeated.

On that note, there are MANY more posts about gliders needing homes on GG. This thread has barely generated 2 pages of activity since 5/21/12...whereas we have a section for gliders that need homes, a whole "discussion type" just for rescues and rehomes. People are posting CL ads trying to help gliders just about daily. There are thousands of posts on GG about the gliders out there needing homes and in stark contrast about 3-4 that have crossed on the topic in this thread. I would say we are just what you say we need to be when thinking about "concerned" topics. We definitely care more about mill breeding and homeless gliders more than FB.

To close on your topic of forgiveness, I think you misinterpreted the core reasons that I am bringing up the past. I am not doing so to throw poo at anyone. I am stating those facts so that we can finally address the real issue that people are concerned about with this topic. I am personally a fan of considering all variables to make sound decisions and this is absolutely a valid point to consider. I am not bringing up the past because I have not "forgiven" - in fact, it's quite the opposite. I hadn't given this much thought until it became a public thread. I don't have a grudge or any ill feelings towards anyone that I may have directed my thread at. And, I delayed my response because I didn't want to appear that I am harboring anything - but facts are facts. You just can't ignore what the undercurrent holds. To do so is putting your head in the sand. Any community that ignores the past for the present and the future is ignoring valuable lessons that they have learned and it will keep them stagnant...fighting a progressive and constructive future. Nobody wants that.

quote:

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Originally posted by RChurch

I am astounded that we're getting this bent out of shape over this sort of topic. Why can't we get this heated over mill breeders? Why can't we get this heated over all the sugar gliders filling up the rescues, that desperately need a home?

I am, however, worried about what the new people here are going to think. They come here seeking answers and they have to sift through all this drama? They will probably go elsewhere for help, or worse, try and figure it out on their own, or just believe the lies PPP have told them. Is that what we want?

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I'm also worried about the ones that find the Facebook page first and wind up led down another path because of it. If people are so concerned with what new people will find here, maybe focus on all the new people posting wrong information! Who cares if they come here if they get bad info anyway? I know I'm done correcting people. Have been for a while now. It turned into accusing someone of being a know it all. My post count has been a curse. I wish no one could even see it.

Oh and if this is the only thread new people can find when searching for help, they have a separate set of issues. Don't even insinuate I have not given my fair share of "heat" over mill breeders, GLIDERS or anything related to them. Let's go ahead and stack my helpful, passionate, informative posts against ones where I'm pissed off over something. Let me know how the ratio turns out. I don't need to be scolded for getting upset over something I know to be valid.

Kazko, I'd be thrilled if you'd either say something here or just lick it already.