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I talked to Steve at Zoologix this week. Zoologix is the only place we have found to date that has a PCR test that actually detects the strain of trichomonas that sugar gliders have. They create PCR tests that they use. They seem to be on the cutting edge in this field. We got to discussing how they are developed. Steve told me that they have to know the strain of whatever protozoa or pathogen they are trying to make a test for in order to make the test. They use a commercial lab to learn the strains rather than doing it themselves. SO, I asked him if he could take a positive test result from 3 1/2 months ago from my glider and send it to the commercial lab to find out the strain? He said ,'yes'. I should have the results back by the end of next week. I only sent one sample for now as each costs $100. I hope it's another step toward learning more about the trich that has begun to pop up in our glider community.
Rukiya Glider  USA 121 Posts Thank you for putting in the effort and money to find answers that could benefit all of us. Although I don't currently face this issue, I am appreciative of any information that you get. quote:
Originally posted by Cora1
Then wonder if he can test cabs too. It was about that long ago I think. They suredid not know then. And thats the whole reason it was sent off was to find the strain, not confirm he had it, we already knew that.
Cora, the test at Zoologix never was able to confirm specific strains. They can only detect DNA from multiple strains. You get a 'yes' or a 'no' for trich. No strain specification. This test is from a different commercial lab that Zoologix uses. Zoologix keeps samples for 6 months. They should be able to do what is necessary to prepare Cab's sample and send it to the commercial lab. The fee is $100 and I was told the result should be available in 1 1/2 weeks. quote:
Originally posted by DoubleBogey
I also comment you TJ for taking the time, energy, and finances to obtain answers in this situation. It's nice to see someone vested in real answers. A lot of gliders and their owners should thank you!
I am blessed that my husband has been so supportive! Steve @ Zoologix in California is who I talk to. If you have had a PCR test done by them (that test is $85) they keep the the samples and results for 6 months. I don't think this is a service they are used to providing all the time. I'm referring to this second test they are getting done for me on my sample (cost is $100). I am sure you can call and see if they will do it for you as well. I speculate that our gliders will all have the same strain. More than 1 sample from 1 location will be needed to prove this. I hope everyone who can will do the test!
Since I am the first to bag the strain test done, we haven't determined the next step. Let me do some research and see who I can come up with. I know Peggy Brewer has suggested people send their results to Dr. Tim Tristan but I haven't talked with him and do not know what he would plan to do with the info once it is gathered. That was supposed to say 'to have' not bag. Typing on my phone. Excuse typos! I got the results from Steve at Zoologix regarding the DNA sequencing of the positive sample I asked them to do. The results state this: "Followup sequencing: 1203220127 amplicon sequence confirmed as Simplicimonas spp. – a recently-characterized group of organisms closely related to Tritrichomonas spp." It is my understanding that these organisms were named as recently as 2010. There doesn't seem to be much information regarding them that is available to the layman. I do know that the DNA seems to be closely enough related to some other organisms that it comes up as 'positive' on tests for those organisms. I have done my best to be helpful and transparent regarding things that I have found. I have spent thousands of dollars on testing when I didn't have sick gliders and have openly shared information and tried to brainstorm to figure what our gliders may have how these organisms may affect them. I had some joey losses and I had one sick glider, Grace who we believe caused issues for 2 of her cagemates. After changing my diet I have had no more joey issues whatsoever. I never had 'ick' joeys in my home. I did testing to be proactive yet, I have been told that I have "unresolved issues" by one person and I now understand that people have been talking behind my back accusing me of having a "google degree". I am not sure how I will 'resolve' issues that appear to have been caused by bad diet? I do not care to deal with people who feel this way about my animals and my facility. At this point, I will not speculate nor will I comment on anything regarding other gliders. I have shared my test results and I wish everyone the very best in caring for their animals. First off, Thank you Helen for the vote of confidence! Next quote:
Originally posted by Omis n Kais g-ma
Okay, I'm going to sound like a complete idiot here but what is it? Signs, symptoms? I've heard the term and looked it up but it only gives me the human definition.
Honestly, none of my gliders that tested positive displayed any issues. The gliders that had positive results didn't lose any joeys, didn't pull joeys, didn't have diarrhea, nothing. EXCEPT for Grace. Grace was diagnosed with Group G Beta Hemolytic Strep in her cloaca from a culture and sensitivity swab. She had 2 different cage mates who got Necrotizing fasciitis of their genitalia' prior to me having the test done. After I got that test, a friend suggested I have her tested for trich. I took her to the vet and had a direct smear done and they saw a swimmer. I then had the PCR test done by Zoologix and it came back positive. We then knew we could test and get a positive result from Zoologix PCR for trich/tritrich. So I sent 30 samples to them. Three came back positive. That made a total of 4 positives in my testing. I changed my diet and added probiotics both at my vet's suggestion. I treated Grace for trich with a 21 day round of metronidazole. I did NOT treat any other cages. I re-tested Grace and 1 other cage after just over 3 months of the different diet/probiotic. Both came back negative! At that point is when I learned we could do the DNA sequencing. I did it for on cage (#13) who had tested positive but never had a single issue and then tested negative after the diet change. These were my results. So, some gliders show up with swimmers on a direct fecal smear, some can test positive on the Zoologix PCR. NONE of my gliders that tested other than Grace gave me any indication they had anything. Go figure?!? JazzNZoeysmom Zippy Glidershorts   USA 5354 Posts Maybe we all need to start banding together and demanding more than "heresay" from the ones that spout.... this diet was created by vets & nutritionists and gliders have been subjected to ongoing testing.... Anytime something is questioned or someone chooses not to use it....this is the mantra I hear... Well, maybe all this testing needs to start being made available. When someone questions it, or doesn't even question it, just has issues, switches and those issues disappear, they are raked over the coals and "proof" that the issues were diet related are demanded...well maybe the demands need to go both ways! I for one am tired of hearing, "healthy joey weights, healthy fur, ect. ect.... Oh that means it's a wonderful diet, BUT when the results are the opposite, it has to be something OTHER than diet. How hypocritical is that? Thank you again Tracey for posting these results and explaining a bit more about this. Omis n Kais g-ma Pouch Protector TX, USA 7524 Posts Did I miss something? I don't think I read anything about a specific diet allegedly causing it. Why can't it justy be some intestinal bacteria they can get from certain unclean foods? I'm obviously completely missing the point or whatever here. Hmm, 'trich' is a yeast like bacterial infection isn't it? And no Lyndia, I've never heard of 'ick'. If you'd like, you can PM me to tell me more about it. Or keep the discussion going so it can be a teaching, health discussion for others to see. quote:
Originally posted by JazzNZoeysmom
Maybe we all need to start banding together and demanding more than "heresay" from the ones that spout....this diet was created by vets & nutritionists and gliders have been subjected to ongoing testing....
Anytime something is questioned or someone chooses not to use it....this is the mantra I hear...
Well, maybe all this testing needs to start being made available. When someone questions it, or doesn't even question it, just has issues, switches and those issues disappear, they are raked over the coals and "proof" that the issues were diet related are demanded...well maybe the demands need to go both ways!
I for one am tired of hearing, "healthy joey weights, healthy fur, ect. ect.... Oh that means it's a wonderful diet, BUT when the results are the opposite, it has to be something OTHER than diet. How hypocritical is that?
Thank you again Tracey for posting these results and explaining a bit more about this.
Cora1 Face Hugger TX, USA 935 Posts DoubleBogey Fuzzy Wuzzy USA 1244 Posts Omis n Kais g-ma Pouch Protector TX, USA 7524 Posts 
quote:
Originally posted by Cora1
Omis, may we have pics?
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