Hi,

My female was pregnant with twins at the beginning of the year and lost her one joey around five weeks ip and then the other joey a few days later. I thought that maybe it was due to her being a first time mom? And then she fell pregnant again with a single joey and lost it a day ago, also at just over five weeks ip.

Please can you give me some insight and advice as to why this happened and what could ponentially have gone wrong.

She is housed with two neutered males (one young and one old), and an intact young male who is under a year old. She is about 2.5 years old.

They are all healthy and eating well on one of the approved diets and they all get along famously.

Its bizarre because I fed her mealworms yesterday morning, and by 6pm yesterday evening when she woke up, her tummy was flat and the joey or any traces of it was gone. Then this morning, one of her teats were sticking out a bit....

The joey was growing so nicely and very active and I could see her tummy moving so much at night.......

Your assistance would be much appreciated........

What diet are you feeding and do you have lineage on the breeding gliders?

With her first pregnancy I was feeding HPW Complete and then I changed over to Gliderkids reduced honey shortly after she lost the first twins.

Live in SA so there is no lineage in this country. I do know for a fact though that they are unrelated in any way as the male comes from Thailand.

What are your thoughts as to what is happening?

Thank you!

Well what it could be is that there's something wrong with the joeys maybe defects and the mom is rejecting and cannibalizing. Another thought is it could be the other males. I've heard of unrelated females pulling joeys out of other female's pouches so it isn't a stretch to think of one of the males doing that since most people who breed try to keep their breeding gliders separate so they aren't stressed or squabble with other gliders.

Those are my top picks as to what's going on. The other ones I've thought of I scratched off the list since these seem more likely.

Good luck!

I would also suspect it has something to do with her being housed with 3 male gliders even though two of them are neutered.

If you really want let her try one more time, I would separate the female and intact male from the other two males and see how it goes.

It may also be that she does NOT want to be a mother and she is the one pulling the joeys, or as said before, the joeys may have some sort of health problem only the gliders recognize which might cause them to pull the joey.

If it happens again, I would definitely neuter the male and just enjoy your 4 gliders as cherished pets.

Thank you for your reply

sounds like there may have been a health defect or maybe she doesn't want to be a suggie mommy! If she pulls again i would make her pet only and keep the whole group as a small pet only colony... Neutering males and all.

I have had a similar experience. First Joey went to about 8 weeks in pouch and then one day it was gone. Since then, my female has had at least 4 sets of twins lost typically between 4 and 6 weeks and often only days apart. Any other info would be appreciated.

Sugar gliders do this thing that is very popular in the animal kingdom where males will sabotage a pregnancy if the child is not theirs. Females will also do this. Gliders can reach into a female's pouch and take the joey out. They can eat the joey, or just pull it off of the nipple so it dies. It is possible that one of the other males is doing this. Even if they are neutered it can happen. It could be something with the female's body, but joey stealing and cannibalizing is sadly VERY common in gliders and many other animals. I would never have other males around if the female is pregnant. Similarly, I would not have other females around! They do this because the baby carries another male's genes, and they want to sabotage that male so that they are able to impregnate the female instead. Neutered males don't know they're neutered. We have a 4 month old that is the son of our female and our male. The dad was being aggressive so we had to separate him. Once the boy reached 3 months, we witnessed him reach into her pouch and attempt to go in there multiple times. Her "pregnancy" then disappeared. I believe he was sabotaging the babies because they weren't his. Also, you mentioned the dad is under a year old. When our male was going to be a dad that young, he was not ready for it and become aggressive towards the babies. It is possible that he himself is doing this as well, because he is young. It could be any of these. Sometimes joeys aren't meant to be. I'm sorry it happened! If you really want joeys I would separate the 2 males. They can be cagemates, and the male/female can be cagemates and maybe they'll have joeys. But it could be him doing it, or she could have issues maintaining the joeys. Make sure she gets a lot of protein and is not stressed out.

Thank you for your feedback and most interesting information...... She accidentally fell pregnant again as I separated her from the intact male too late. I didnt realise she would come on heat so soon after she lost her joeys. Was not planning for her to be preggies again.....

So I have separated her from the two other neutered males in her cage and she now only stays with the intact male.

At this point she is around 5 weeks IP with twins and her tummy seems to be growing better this time and the babies are very active! Am keeping a very close eye on her and feeding her extra protein and keeping many different food stations in the cage.

A question: Should I keep their cages close together so that they can be re-introduced once the joeys are weaned and allow supervised playtime at night, or will this be too stressful for them all? At the moment they are right next to each other and they all try and get to each other and put their hands through the bars and hold each other. So what do I do to create the least amount of stress all-round?

Also, is there anything specific I can feed to to assist her with milk production?

Thank you very much....

Now that you have separated them... at this point i think you should not reintroduce them unless you are planning to neuter the dad and keep them as a pet only pair.

To cause less stress it would be best to move their cages so that they cannot reach each other and put something in between the cages so they do not see each other..

Well, my little girl is doing so well and is six weeks IP now! Her cage mates were moved to the other room and Mom and Dad have settled really well!

Quick question - when should the last day be that the cage is washed and the pouch changed before the babies come OOP?

And once they are OOP, when can a clean pouch be put in for the new family?

Thank you!

you can wash and clean cage even when Mom has joeys IP… normally what I do is take the pouch they are in and stick them in a temp cage for the time it takes me to wash and dry the cage then put them back in… Before I put them back in I swap out for a new pouch so that they aren't in a stinky pouch all the time… You can still clean and swap out cage sets... as long as the cage sets dont smell like the other gliders (if it does may stress out mom... and cause issues...).... :P

Thank you! All is well and momma is almost 7 weeks ip now and her pouch is growing nicely - she is eating like a little piggy! Lol! She is a tiny tot so it looks so weird to see her bigger! She has picked up over 8g now and although she spends more time in her pouch, she is still super active when she is out.

Dad has chilled out so much - its like he knows he has to grow up case he is about to bacome a Dad!

Glad to hear all is well and I look forward to seeing pictures :D

My girl passed the 7 week mark on Friday and has picked up a total of 16g so far! 5g of them was from Thursday till this evening, so the joeys are growing beautifully . She has started spending quite a bit more time in her pouch and is half as active as she normally is! Would this be due to her increase in size and her starting to nest and prepare for the twins?

Dad has also chilled so much in the last week or so and is always near her! It is truly beautiful to witness.....

keep us informed! I'm pulling for you that all will go well!!

Thank you and will do