so, heres the list, and note this is day two..... i need help, im a good patient person, who got suckered into buying an abused and traumatised adult. im a first time owner and expected an at least semi docile being, so onward past the forword and unto the list.

didnt leave her alone the first two days, inadvertently traumatised her more

bought a toxic cage and tossed it, made a temp habitat in a closet

chased her around the cage and caught her in a bag becuse youtube said so, thusly accidently adding to her trauma.

let her roam free having to catch her again....

ok so i learned alot, i just want some reassurance i havent perma damaged her, im going with what my heart says and not youtube, and m going to go at her pace, ganna leave her alone for a few days, and just make breif visiable apearences and make yogurt peace offerings. i have patience just got in a bad situation, and made it worse. im an ex adventurer, turned high priority security, i live in a mobile home, now glider proofed. i need advice, help, and finincially feasable options, i have her, no going back, and i have endless free time mostly at night. theres the beans, now i need to stew.

You can try and and let her see you put her food in and if she's awake offer her some treats by putting them them trough the bars. If she doesn't come at first don't be disappointed she will eventually start taking it from from your fingers. When she trust you enough to ask you for more grab a treat and slowly move your hand into the cage and let her come to your hand, she will be scared at first but she will also want the treat. She may or may not come and take it but if she does keep doing that. Until she try's to get out of the cage and/or climbs your arm after that I think you know how to treat her.

Don't beat yourself up too much. You're here, you've saved a dear life. After only two days you can't have made irreparable damage to your ability to gain her trust.

Leaving her completely alone isn't necessary. You can sit quietly by while she is awake and speak to her in a low voice, some even sing. Offer treats as suggested.

You say you've had to make a make-shift habitat. I understand your situation. You've asked for economical advice in that respect. There is always craigslist and the classifieds, but as many have experienced it is quite difficult to find a glider safe cage in the size needed and at a fair price. Take a look at some of the PVC pipe and landscaping mesh cages that people here have created. There are even some with the plans included. (I will try to find a link to some...or there may be someone who will come along with some links.

Let's check out her health. Given her background how does she look (post a picture if you can). Does she seem to be a healthy weight? Is she eating well and seem to be hydrated (if any concerns try the tent test but that may not be possible right away as I'm sure you are both a bit trigger shy right now). Is her coat 'stained' and looking brown in places instead of a consistent gray and light cream? Is her nose nice and pink? Eyes wide and bright? Ears perked up? Are you taking note of her feces for a normal appearance and amount? She will need a vet check and you will need to search your area for a REPUTABLE vet who actually knows how to treat gliders. Many absolutely have no idea how to diagnose and help gliders.

Ok. How is her diet? What had she been fed and what are you now feeding?

This long list will get us going on a start toward a good path for you and your new little girl. It is great that you are able to spend a good portion of the night with her. She will need a cage mate because humans just can't provide everything that a gliders can for each other. They are animals that thrive in a colony and simply need to be kept together with at least one bonded friend. That will take time and we can continue that discussion later. First things first.

ohh my, you both have had a rough start my friend, so sorry to hear that. this is my second attempt to reply to this thread I completely lost my first draft Blue touched on a few things I was going to mention so I'l not repeat them .

However, To add to what He said...

Most people bond with gliders using bonding bags ( 15$-30$ range ) Or you can make one yourself if your handy with a needle and thread, all you need is a soft fleece blanket and a shoe string to make a draw string closure. If by chance you'r not handy with a needle and can't afford to buy a pouch I would be happy to make You one for free. They don't take me that long and I have material to spare. If it is needed I would just need an address to send it to.

Does she have a sleeping pouch?

You can use the bonding bag during the day while she is sleeping, causing less stress for both of you by trying to catch her. You can use the bonding pouch like an oven mit to pick her up (she won't see your hand coming at her this way) flip it inside out put your hand in it, gently pick her make sure she is not still hanging onto something, keep holding her with your hand in the pouch and use your other hand to flip the pouch right side out. Now she is safely inside the pouch and both of your hands are outside the pouch. If she crabs ( screeches ) hold her firmly ( but don't squish )and talk to her until she settles down.

She needs to get to know your scent and accept you as her colony ( family ) Having her in the bonding bag during the day lets her take in your scent while she is sleeping. You can also place a shirt you have worn on top of her cage preferably not inside the cage, so she can also have your scent when she is awake at night. Usually they are to active at night to try to keep them in the bonding bag so it's best to only have her in there during the day or when she normally sleeps.

She will also need some toys to stimulate her, especially after being alone so long. Toys don't have to be expensive, my Leela likes the simple things best. Like a loosely braided nylon rope for her to undo, braided fleece vines to climb and jump on ( i cut strips from a fleece blanket and braid them), plastic soda bottle caps and rings, she absolutely loves the little rings that secures the bottle caps she carries them all over the place. a clean coolwhip or sourcream container with 2" holes in the side and lid to get inside, filled with little squares of fleece (from the same blanket ) or pompom balls (from the dollar store ) Cat toys are ok as long as they are catnip free catnip is toxic to gliders. Cut up straws, sometimes I make little holes in a lid and put short straws in them for her to pull out, I also poke the straws in fruit or put honey inside the straw so its a toy and a treat. There are lots of things you can make yourself with stuff you may already have.

The one thing you will probably have to invest in is an wheel for her to run on. I'm sure someone can post links for glider safe wheels for you or google it...

Another thought for a cage is maybe see if there is a glider rescue place near you that can help find a suitable cage that's reasonable or perhaps even donated and free? I am not sure where you are located or if there is a rescue near by but I know my local rescue lady would bend over backwards to help someone trying to provide a good home. She is always available to answer any of my questions even though I didn't get Leela from her rescue.

I am located in fort myers fla, and am serious about the bonding bag, will even make a sleeping pouch to match for her if you need it. Sometimes these little babies with a history like you'rs has never had a soft pouch to sleep in or toys to play with. That is the case with the rescue glider Simon we are getting in a few weeks for a companion for Leela. He has never had such things in his cage until He found His way to the rescue. So that is my reason for offering to make you'rs one, I have a soft spot from Simon and after reading your story It sounds similar to His.

So please don't hesitate to take me up on it lol Shipping would be my only expense (that can't be all that much) and worth it to me to be able to help if need be.

I think you'r new baby has found a great new forever home so don't beat yourself up, I am still learning new things everyday about Leela lol and I have made mistakes as well. I was giving Leela drinks during the day and she seemed to loveeeeee it, what I was actually doing was filling her up and decreasing her appetite for the food she needed. She looked great, healthy coat and tail bright clear eyes.....but wasn't eating much at night. Once I asked here and found out what I was doing wrong I fixed it. Her appetite is back with a vengeance and I no longer give her drinks. My point is we all make mistakes the best we can do is find the mistake and fix it. Which is what you are doing!

ok, so previous diet, and i quote "she just eats fruit and stuff" i give her a couple apple slices a grape, a bottle cap of peach yogurt and pellets, she wont touch the pellets, gnaws the apple slightly, peels the grapes leaving nothing else, and inhales the yogurt. im not sure if she is drinking the water i leave her, i mixed it 1 part light pear syrup and 3 parts water.

she has a bonding pouch, and a dog sweater she came with that she sleeps in. she has nested in my hat (true love, im a real cowboy who gave the lady my hat) so yeah thats diet. as far as color she does seem a little beige, but once she awakes ill get a picture for you, weight, sh3 seems light, but then again what do i know. she didnt poop at first, it is a darker browny color finaly found a turd, its solid and stuck to my finger when i was for some awfull reason looking for it....

her space is nice and may just convert it into a better habitat. its an rv closet, with larger dimentions then the minumum cage req. the only thing is last night she skipped fruit entirely and only ate the yogurt.... cheeky.

now i do worry about her activity, she frolics but not much when the door is closed, i notice she kinda just perches as high as she can and sits there, possibly for hours, but then again i have to open a door and this just may be here retreat zone.

It's hard to picture the closet but it sounds to be a good size. The only concern is that there is enough natural light during the day to keep her wake/sleep cycle going and how to clean a space like that. You'll find that they can be quite messy and the easier it is to clean the better...before the really strong smells set in. It's best (and hygienic)to have something that can be taken either outside for a thorough scrubbing (mild dish soap and very good rinsing or vinegar solution, etc.) Some people without that possibility can take the cage to a tub or shower enclosure.

I would absolutely toss the sweater immediately. The loose strands are well known to cause them to get a foot, toe etc. entangled and either will damage the appendage...or they will chew off the body part in an attempt to get free.

I love that she likes your hat. Put some fleece and her pouch etc. in there for her to nest for now. She would prefer pouches hung high in her enclosure...their nature it to nest up in trees. They'll spend the majority of their play time climbing high and jumping, messing with toys, definitely running in a wheel (it MUST be glider safe...more tragic stories on those because of their tails or their paws, google raptor wheels, stealth wheels and the like, but beware they are costly at first...but worth it. I have a feeling you are handy with some tools and you may be able to find a template for the wheel. Couple plastic pieces, landscape mesh, pvc fittings, a bearing, etc.) Not a lot of time is spent at the bottom of their enclosure.

At least you found some droppings and sorry that one stuck but that makes it seem that she is hydrated and not constipated. The fruit has helped with that.

Now. First real dilemma so far. The diet. People have their own opinions...but you will find on this site that there are many experienced people who have been able to keep these fuzz butts healthy and happy for the many years (in captivity realistically 8-10 as many as 15 years). The diets used for these gliders is one of the key things to keeping them really thriving. There are many of what we consider "approved" diets on the glider pedia tab above. Some are more complicated than others. Some have extremely specific proportions and ingredients while others allow a bit more variation. Some require ordering certain ingredients online. As cost and just getting things going in the right direction are a concern...you might go ahead and give the BML diet a look. This diet is popular, especially when first starting out, because everything can be purchased at the grocery store and a pet store. This is a very strict diet and must be followed exactly as written.

Frankly, the pellets (are never a suitable diet) fruit and yogurt just aren't going to provide what she needs nutritionally to be not only healthy but to be at her optimal level of happiness and full of 'spunk'.

I think that will get you a little further down the path for now. Would love to see a picture of the little girl.

By the way...Blue Nostalgic is female...not that it matters!

Welcome to the forum and to glider parenthood. Sorry you feel like you have had a rougn start - and we all make mistakes when we do not have all the information we need to care for gliders.

First - Leela - a word of caution:

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a needle and thread, all you need is a soft fleece blanket and a shoe string to make a draw string closure.

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Hand sewing a pouch is often not at all safe. You cannot make the tiny, close and tight stitches that a machine would make to make your bonding pouch glider safe. Long stitches can snag a glider nail or toe and cause injury if a glider struggles to get free. Shoe laces in general are a loosely woven material that are also a nail snag hazzard and MANY gliders can push a draw string pouch open and escape - Keep an extra close eye on your glider when you are using your bonding pouch.

Now - Thebadparent - I wish you had not chosen that screen name because you will be a great parent once you get your questions answered and have a little time to learn more about gliders. Your name will not be true at all if a very short time.

First just take a deep breath and calm down. You have not done any permanent damage to your relationship with your glider. You just need to relax and start again slowly. Bonding happens a the gliders pace often not meeting the expectations of the human side of the 'family'.

I encourage you to get a suitable cage as soon as you can. The TV cabinet will not be suitable long term because you will not be able to adequately clean it and the smell will soon become a problem. It lacks ventilation which will just increase the odor.

Diet is a very important decision you need to make to help keep your glider healthy.
Most of the widely used glider feeding plans include a recipe for a STAPLE that will provide the protein, vitamins and calcium your glider must have each day. The Staple is fed with a wide variety of fruits and vegetables to bring in a full compliment of vitamins and minerals they provide.

I have links on my web page to several widely used feeding plans including my own GliderKids Staple recipes to help you locate the information needed to choose one of these feeding plans. The recipes make enough to feed 2 gliders for about a month (my recipes are for a larger batch and will feed 1 glider for 3-4 months) Once mixed the nectar like staple is frozen in ice cube trays for easy serving each evening.

http://www.gliderkids-diet.com/Staple-Recipes.html

Until you choose a diet and get the ingredients you need you can feed your glider a small amount of scrambled or hard boiled egg, plain cooked chicken or baby food chicken or turkey each night along with about 1 TBS fresh or frozen fruit and 1 TBS fresh or frozen vegetables. Feed your glider shortly before she wakes up each evening so she will learn that there will always be food for her all night.

As for beginning to bond with your glider, you have had some good tips.

Cut a few pieces of fleece (3 or 4 inch squares are fine) and either tuck them in your clothes for a few hours or sleep with them in your pillowcase overnight to get your scent on them. These can be tucked in her sleeping pouch to help her learn your scent.

When you are near the cage talk to her quietly and calmly and always talk to her before you open the cage door or touch her pouch to help her learn your voice and that you are a safe creature to be around.

After a few days she will calm down and you can offer treats on your open hand to encourage her to come to you. She must learn to trust you and your hands for bonding to really begin.

There are more bonding and care tips in the Gliderpedia (button on the header of this page) to help you as well.

One more thought - PLEASE remove the dog sweater. It is most likely a knitted yarn material which is very dangerous for glider nails and toes. The nails can get twisted in the loose threads of the yarn and cause severe injuries.

You can replace it with a piece of fleece, but a sleeping pouch is even better for her.

the dog sweater is one solid peice of fleece, i know of the fabric thing. as far as the enclosure i was going to replace the door with plexiglass, drill some holes for ventilation(more than a few) and attach climbing surfaces, as of now i leave the door open when im in, which is allot. ill add peices of boiled egg tonight.

i want to make sure its sanitary for the two of us, my home is small and moves around alot,the space will end up being temperary but until i pay off a small debt im on a feirce budget (i pay debts fast, but may be a month or three before i can spare more than 50 bucks at a time.

the wheel will have to wait a week or so, but the ventalation and visability will be fixed this afternoon.

as diet goes, ill get veggies for her as well, allready have the fruit, and the egg, and soonish mealworms.

how quickly will her bathroom habits start to take effect, although i have petsafe surface cleaner ill mix it with some water, the walls wont absorb the urine, they are waterproof, my home is waterproof, as before mentioned i am an ex professionsl adventurer.

as for the name, i just want the meaning of my title to change, as i wsnt to spoil her.

so recap

get cage, itll have to be a minute

better suit current enclosure

improve her diet

get a wheel

sing to her and take things slow

get my hat back, and wear it sometimes, my scent has drennched the thing

what landscaping mesh styles are glider freindly? theres allot to choose from

Changing her diet and getting her a cagemate are both very important. If you have a new glider where you don't know all about their health and their previous diet wasn't good and you aren't too familiar with them, you almost certainly need to buy a staple until you figure out what you want to do. There are a lot of diet options but this one is the cheapest and simplest, I have found (I have a very tight budget too). I would go here www.thepamperedglider.com/supplements.htm and purchase "HPW Sample Pack" which is the second option on the second row.

It costs $6.45 and will last you over a month, giving you time to figure out everything you need. You mix the wombaroo powder and bee pollen they send you with eggs, honey, and water.
Here is the recipe: www.gliderdad79.com/hpw.php

You'll make this batch and freeze it. This is the staple, or protein, of her diet. You won't need to give eggs, which are high in cholesterol and fat, or any other protein forms for her while she eats this. The glider should get 1 TBSP of this per night, plus 1 TBSP fresh fruit and 1 TBSP fresh veggies. Pretty simple and it has a lot of the nutrients they need. This little sample pack has been great for me, it's the easiest to make and you get it within a few days. If your budget is too tight to always have fresh foods you can use frozen fruits like berries and such as needed, but fresh is always better.

Some of my gliders absolute favorite foods are: sweet red apple, banana, boiled sweet potato, boiled cabbage, boiled carrot, cucumber, mealworm, yogurt, honey. I advise against feeding grapes as there have been cases of sudden death linked to grape consumption. Nothing is proven but grapes are known as toxic to dogs and quite a few glider owners have omitted grapes because of these unexplained deaths associated with grapes.

Order this so you have her on a healthy diet while you adjust. You can switch her diet at any time, but they pretty much all require you to order something online. The only other thing you should watch out for is that for the fruit/veggie you give each night, try to get the calcium/phosphorus ratio a bit above 2/1. Here is a link showing the ratio for various glider safe foods. www.critterlove.com/uploads/1/0/3/5/10355506/_sugar_glider_safe_fruits__veggies.pdf

It isn't always possible, but a glider's c/p ratio should be 2:1. The HPW stable is slightly below this, so the f/v should be slightly above it. Oranges, green cabbage, kale, and papaya are a few that are high in calcium. I have also used calcium and vitamin D fortified orange juice when low on calcium.

You and the glider will be fine, it takes patience and calmness and persistence. Always let her come to you if possible. Make sure the closet has air flow and is a good temperature for her, and that it's dark at night. Get her diet straightened out first, then start looking for a friend for her! She will be MUCH calmer with a friend, and get used to you faster and easier too. Good luck!!

@ Candy - I don't use standard sewing thread I use sinew. It's rather thick and waxed and does not fray or break ( 70 lb test ) and I haven't had an ounce of trouble with it. The stitches are not visible inside or out, they aren't straight stitches like sewing machines stitches that can become loose. The stitches are only on the sides of the pouch and around the netting, the fleece hides the stitch completely since the sinew is waxed I can pull it tighter than thread which rolls the fleece so to speak hiding the stitches so there is no way she can get snagged or stitches loose, there is no seam on the bottom. The ends are knotted and melted so there is no loose sinew at all even at the ends.

As for the draw string I have had no issues with it either, the holes are evenly spaced a half inch apart. I lace it up pull it tight then wrap the string around the base of the lacing and tie it. She has never gotten out of it, there is no gap to possibly get out. I have many years of leather work under my belt and used some of those skills and did my research to make a safe and durable bonding pouch. The only possible way she can escape is to tear through the netting, which I am sure I would notice that. The only time she is in her pouch is if we take her out of our house and she is on me the entire time. I do check it after it's been washed to make sure the netting hasn't been damaged, so far it's holding up wonderfully.

I should have explained this earlier and I understand other people may read this that should be made aware of issues that you are speaking of. But I wanted to clarify that I hadn't just slopped together a non safe pouch with out really considering everything you stated and taking measures to make her pouch safe and secure.

@ Blue - OMG I am sooo sorry for referring to you as a He! I really need to stop posting on here before I've had sufficient coffee intake!

@ theGoodParent :) I'm glad she has pouches to sleep in and a hat! lol We are also in an RV and this is just a suggestion... If you plan on keeping her in the closet rather than a traditional cage perhaps you can take out the center panel of the door and replace it with netting so you can see her and she can see you. It will also help give her some natural light during the day and give her fresh air ( it gets pretty hot in our cupboards and closet ). If she is always in the dark it could mess up her natural sleep time and awake time. The daylight is her cue to go to sleep the darkness is her alarm clock to wake her up. If you'r closet is anything like ours You may be able to add some netting on the side of the closet as well, the side of ours is right next to our bedroom and window. Probably will require some power tools and maybe some sort of plastic trim/molding to secure the netting and cover the rough edges? Any way good luck to you !!

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what landscaping mesh styles are glider freindly? theres allot to choose from

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The mesh used for many home made glider cages is a black plastic 'hardware' cloth with 1/2 inch square openings. It is very sturdy and most gliders cannot chew through it. It is often called Landware and can be found in the lawn and garden /fencing department at Lowes or Home Depot.

do not get the thin plastic very flexible landscape mesh used to keep deer from eating plants or rabbits out of a garden. It is not sturdy enough to withstand glider teeth.

Metal hardware cloth is NOT safe - it is zink coated and may be toxic and it often has many small very sharp points that a glider can get cut on when they rub against the wire to mark the cage.

how quickly will her bathroom habits start to take effect

In an enclosed space you will definitely begin to notice the odor within a few days. Wiping out the bottom of the enclosure daily to remove glider pee, pooh and scraps of food that will be scattered through out the cage will delay but not prevent the odor. The problem will be that any wood parts of the cage will absorb glider pee and the odor will build up quickly. If the edges of the wood (? particle board - usually found in TV cabinets) are not sealed and glider pee seeps between pieces, it will soak into the material.

aaaaaaugh help me guys, she barely has eaten today, or yesterday, now its late and she just stays in my hat..... she wont eat much of anything and isnt active, and is acting more agressive, i just got her, i was expecting somthing like my freinds glider who adapted, what if the move was just too stressfull, shes scared and im scared.

It's normal for her to be scared and not eat for a few days. And to be inactive at first...she has to get used to everything. Her whole world just changed and she needs to settle in.

Also are you leaving her food to eat at night?

It is also normal for them to be inactive and are usually sleeping during the day time.

As long as you leave food for her to eat off and on all night long and fresh water(bottled, purified or filtered spring water if you can, tap water can contain chlorine, chloramines and fluoride and such) she will come around. A healthy glider will not starve itself.

bottled water, and often food changed, im nocturnal as i work special security. night one she was active, nihgt two, just perched in the top corner, and now tonight she hasnt gotten out of bed. im a little worried as i have no idea to figure out her health

Do you keep lights or even a television on late?

If you are also 'nocturnal'that is another thing that can keep her in bed.

Just like she needs to know when the sunrises and sets with natural lighting. You may have too much light in the room(s) for her liking. You can get a red light bulb and put in a lamp and turn off all other lights and then you can see her and the red light does not bother them light a regular light sometimes does.

I have a torch lamp(regular light)on a timer switch...so now going into winter months the house gets darker earlier and earlier, so I set the timer for the light to come on and goes off at a regular time each night. Then another lamp with the red light.

nvm all, shes fine, she escaped, and has been great since, she frolics and is avtually social... weird guess she just needed out time lol

Weird. How big is her cage?

When you're first getting used to each other it's like having an infant. It seems like you can't take your eyes of of them and watch for the tiniest little change. As she sets into her normal rhythm you'll be able to relax a bit more and will know when something is really wrong.

I do understand that there is still concern for this little one as we aren't really sure about her true health. So far, you're sounding like a great glider parent and learning all you can to help her have a better life.

You've gotten TONS of advice. Plenty to get started. I'd be cautious of the "pet safe spray cleaner". Most are not safe where gliders are concerned. A rag with vinegar and water mixture will most likely be the best for her enclosure at this time. Also, no sprays (aerosols or anything that mists) should be used around her. They have such tiny and somewhat fragile respiratory systems. A respiratory infection or like problem can take them down fast.

I am very eager to see how your expeditions with her progress. My husband and I have plans to hit the road permanently in an RV in the next few years. Our sons will be grown and our work is in transition to take us cross country. I keep looking at RV's and thinking about how to make a suitable situation for glider comfort and safety as well as not completely compromising our own space. I've got some great ideas for enclosures but not exactly for a suitable large glider safe play area. It isn't exactly "ideal" I suppose, but everything will be built to suit before we take the plunge.

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im nocturnal as i work special security. night one she was active, nihgt two, just perched in the top corner, and now tonight she hasnt gotten out of bed. im a little worried as i have no idea to figure out her health

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she barely has eaten today, or yesterday, now its late and she just stays in my hat...

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(posted at 10:48 pm)

Are you taking her to work with you? Are you in an area where the lights are on at night?

Gliders need light during normal day light hours and really appreciate darkness in the evenings after sunset. This exposure to normal light cycles helps gliders regulate their circadian rhythm - sleeping all day and awake most of the night. (sorry if this has been posted before - I feel like I have said it a lot lately for new owners and may have given you this information in one of your other posts)

Are you expecting her to eat during the day time?

Most gliders do not wake up to eat ANYTHING during the daylight hours. They eat primarily at night when they are awake and active. They also have very small stomachs about the size of the tip of your thumb. They cannot eat a large amount at one time, but eat off and on all night long to consume the amount they need to sustain themselves.

Put the food in the cage about sunset - or about 30 minutes before your glider usually wakes up. The foods should be left in the cage all night long for your glider to eat as much as she wants and needs. Remove the leftovers in the morning when she has gone to sleep for the day.