Hi, I wanted to start feeding my two gliders dahlias diet and wasn't sure if it can be given with the LGRS suggie soup. I noticed that most people use the HPW or BML with dahlias diet so I wanted to be sure because I want my gliders to get the right nutrition. I love them so much and have had them for a little over a year but I'm not sure they're getting the right nutrition and I have to make sure they are. If anyone can please help with advice or ideas it would be greatly appreciated. Thank you so much #128522;

Bml has it's own fruit and veg list and doesn't use Dahlia recipes with it. The fruit and veg are usually just cut up and put on a plate or taken out of the freezer and put on a plate no blending or smoothies.

I'm not all that versed in Dahlia's recipes or why they were once used. But they aren't something currently being used by many. There are a lot of old threads on this site, that have out dated information on them.

From the bits of old threads I've seen about those recipes they are blended smoothie like recipes and or relishes? the relishes, providing they aren't blended in a blender would be ok.

However, blending fruits and veg in a blender forces the gliders to eat insoluble fiber they don't usually eat ( they spit it out ) and can't be digested. Most people now a days don't suggest feeding blended fruits n veg for this reason.

I don't see a specific list of fruits and veg that is supposed to be fed with the lgrs all it says is the portion of fruit and veg to be served along with the lgrs.

Bml, and Critter love Hpw diets have specific fruits and veg or salad mixtures that are designed to work with the staple itself. They are different, and diet specific. That is one of the benefits of feeding those diets, it takes the guess work out of it for the owner.

Another benefit is that the creators of those diets are still active in the glider community and are available to answer questions about their diet. I have no idea who the maker of Dahlia's recipes is or how to reach her to ask her any questions about them. Any diet question is best answered by the diets creator, in my opinion. They know their diet better than anyone else and what tweaks CAN be made if a tweak is needed.

I am so grateful that you responded so swiftly and want to say thanks for that. Right now I feel kind of lost on making sure that their diet is what they require and need. Now that I know dahlias diet is from a while ago I'm not going to worry about using it. I am thinking about switching to the BML or HPW because it is so popular and easier to get info on. I have been giving the LGRS as a staple along with fresh fruit and veg every night but just feel like they need more nutrition. I always give green beans and carrots every night and alternate between pears apples or oranges. Sometimes I buy baby spinach or give collard greens as well. I also feel like I end up having to throw a lot of fruit and beg away bc it goes bad by the time they get to finish it all. I'm looking for help from someone who has experience with giving different fruits and veg to their gliders and ideas on a variety that works. I know I would get tired of the same meals so I want to give them different meals too. I'm also not sure about the whole ratio thing and how to incorporate that into their diet in a not so confusing way because I worry about them getting hind leg paralysis. I want them to live as long as possible.

well don't feel like your alone in that, diet is one of the most confusing, controversial and contradictory topics regarding gliders. Almost all new owners go through it.

Variety is also usually one of the first concerns. For a long time I didn't like the bml diet because it was "so restrictive" on the fruits and veg. I wanted to give them variety and keep it interesting.

What I didn't know was that variety may not necessarily be the best thing for them nutritionally, which is my first priority.

Over time I learned that my gliders thrive on routine, including their food. Even when I was trying to give them a wide variety, the gliders ate the "restricted list" of fruits n veg the best and most consistently. So now, that's what they get. I don't go looking for weird, seasonal, exotic fruits and veg anymore. The primarily like melons, blueberries, cherries so that is mostly what they get with grapes and apples thrown in once in a while as they aren't their favorites. Same with veg, mixed veg, or individual peas, green beans, carrots, corn.

The variety for bml comes from what you serve each night. for example:
Monday- bml, peas, watermelon
tues- bml, mixed veg, apples
weds- bml, green beans, blueberries
thurs- bml, corn, cherries
frid- bml, carrots, honey dew melon
sat- bml, peas, grapes
Sun- bml, mixed veg, cantaloupe

no two days are the same, yet all of the fruits and veg are on the bml list of what to feed.

If your over feeding, often times the gliders actually eat less. Try measuring out the portions of fruits and veg. For Bml I serve 1 tablespoon fruit and 1 tabelspoon veg PER glider ( that is what is suggested for this diet ) . There is usually still a little left on the plate. When I don't measure, and get heavy handed with portions they eat less and I throw more out.

The ratio, omg the ratio about made me pull my hair out The ratio for bml has already been calculated for you, you don't need to try to figure it out.

I believe ( but not positive ) the same goes for the Critter Love hpw diets. Not all hpw diets are the same. The exotic nutrition hpw is not the same as the Critter love, the critter love has salad mixtures ( fruits and veg ) there are 3 recipes for the salads I believe. This is where the "variety" comes in for this diet.

The ratio simplified

the 2:1 ratio is the "goal" or magic number your striving for.

the first number, no matter what the number is represents Calcium.
the : represents "to"
the second number, no matter what the number is represents phosphorous

so really what you are looking at is this


calcium (2) to (:) Phos (1) = 2:1

Why is this important to understand? the intestines absorb phosphorus more than twice as efficiently as calcium, a higher calcium-phosphorus ratio is desirable in the diet (1.5:1, 1.7:1, and 2:1, which has been found optimal for bone formation in many animal studies).

now if the second number is higher than the first, they are getting far to much phosphorous. But this can be balanced by adding another food with a higher calcium and lower phos content. ( now that you know what the 2:1 ratio stands for you should be able to see which foods are higher in calcium than phosphorous to compare the two foods )

IF you feed two foods with say a 12:5 ratio and a 9:4 ratio ( just an example ) you are giving them to much calcium and it's not balanced either.

Some diets have already done all this for you, some diets don't. Some people try to feed by ratio's, this can quickly become a nightmare. When feeding by ratio's many things aren't factored in, their focus is just the ratio. There are vitamins and minerals that need to be in balance as well. There are other things that affect the bodies usage of vitamins and minerals. Like for example vitamin C, makes the body utilize Iron at a faster rate, for gliders to much iron can be hard on the internal organs. One diet tried to reduce the level of iron, however they added orange juice concentrate with vit c, so now the body may not be getting as much iron but the body is optimized to absorb it at a faster rate. So really, was it beneficial or more harmful ?

Like I said, unless you fully understand what each food and what that food contains is going to do to the body, feeding this way can be a night mare.

It's much more practical to follow a diet that has all of this figured out for you. As long as you are following the recipe exactly as it's written, and serving as directed by that diet creator ...you really can't mess it up.

Leela,
You have been such a huge help and really appreciate all of your feedback. I do have some of the LGRS suggie soup left but as soon as it's gone I am going to switch to the BML diet. It does seem like it's much easier to use than the other diets and I don't like all the guessing. I want to know that they are getting what they need. I do end up throwing a lot of fruit and veg away. I was curious about the BML diet and all the different fruits and veg that's given. When you buy all the different fruit and veg do they end up going bad? Or how do you keep them all of them fresh for as long as possible? I have heard of people freezing them but I'm always afraid they will thaw out in a weird way like end up soggy. Also when you say mixed veg do you mean the kind in the bag that's frozen at the grocery store?

When I only had one or two gliders I fed them mostly fresh fruits n veg. My female didn't seem to like anything once it went in the freezer... however she was just young and I didn't realize at the time that joeys kind of grow into eating their fruits and veg.

With 8 gliders it's not as practical to feed all fresh So yes most of the time their veg is frozen unless I do a junk food night and give them corn on the cob or something.

Yes bags of frozen mixed veg in the freezer section at the grocery store, corn, lima beans, green beans, peas, carrots, corn.

*** No onions in the mix, some soup or stew mixed veg bags have onions in the mix so make sure to read the ingredients.

(* Lima beans are not on the bml list, but there aren't many in the bags of mixed veg, there is no need to pick them out if they get one or two that is ok )

For variety I also buy a bag of frozen peas, a bag of frozen green beans, a bag of frozen corn. This lets me change things up and alternate what I serve them.

Fruit...... some fruit is what would get watery and mushy from freezing, most veg holds up pretty good except squash ( which you don't feed on bml ) . The higher the water content in the food the mushier and waterier it gets when frozen to thawed.

For instance, watermelon would get mushy once thawed, so I don't freeze melons. I buy pre cut fruit cups from my grocery store in the fruit n veg section. Our fruit cups have 3 kinds of melon, grapes, and a chunk of pineapple and a couple strawberries.

I eat the pineapple and strawberries ( they are not on the bml fruit list ) and the gliders get the rest. With 8 gliders a small fruit cup lasts me about 2 or 3 days so their is little waste. I have to get a new one today, I'll try to remember to takes pic of it later for you.

Blueberries do freeze very well and don't get mushy. I buy a carton of fresh blueberries and just put it in the freezer.

Cherries also freeze very well, I buy fresh when in season, pit them and put them in the freezer. When they are not in season I buy already frozen dark sweet cherries in the frozen fruit section.

Blackberries freeze well, same as blueberries

Apples I haven't tried to freeze, one medium apple feeds all 8 so I don't throw any away.

Grapes, some people freeze grapes, I don't because my guys don't care for grapes to much so they only get them like once a week from the fruit cup.

Everything but the fruit is still frozen, it will be thawed by the time my guys wake up and come out to eat.

Dinner for two



Dinner for three



Dinner for three with food aggression so theirs is on two plates, but it's the same portions as the first picture for three



Fruit cup from Publix then I usually cut the chunks up smaller cause my brats are spoiled

Leela,
Hi sorry it's been a while I've been super busy with school. I first want to thank you for all the helpful feedback and the pictures which by the way I love the blanket in the background we have the same one #128522; I am going to buy some frozen vegs because it would be much easier. It's so nice to have someone so friendly and helpful to help with my little babies because it can be stressful worrying about them getting taken care of the proper way. I will say having eight of them seems pretty awesome. I would love to one day so the whole mating process and the joeys but I'm not ready yet and wouldn't want to risk their wellbeing because they are very fragile little ones in the beginning. So do you have to give a calcium or vitamin powder with the BML diet? Also I do use the same fruit cups for my babies and I do cut the fruit up for them. I even cut their chicken up in little pieces when I boil that for them too. It's hard not to spoil them because they're just so darn cute. #9786;#65039;

no worries the calcium and multivitamin powders go right in the bml mixture. DO NOT sprinkle any on top or offer any extra, it isn't needed and to much can be just as bad as not enough.

All the ingredients except the fruit n veg gets put into a blender and blended for about 10 minutes, this evenly distributes the calcium powder and multivitamin through out the mix.


8 are fun for sure, but after the joey is out of pouch that brings me to 9, which is about 8 passed my boyfriends limit I will be done once the joey is here. Breeding is definately a whole other beast entirely. I am allowing this pair to breed under guidance of my mentor. I wouldn't venture into breeding without her. There are risks to consider, and breeding can be as heart breaking as a joeys face is heartwarming. I don't have it in me to sell joeys so I will be keeping the first round of joey or joey's ( right now I think there is only one joey in there) , if they have a second pair I will gift them to someone I know.

Then my lil man will getting neutered. Once he is neutered, the female paired with him can still produce another set for the following 12 months after his neuter, if they bred prior to his neuter. After the 12 months they will be a retired pair, I'm not sure she's gonna be happy with that lol but she'll get over it.

Lol yes they will get over it just like my two did expect they never had the chance to have joeys because when I did get my second glider which was my male one it was to keep my female company. I only had my female for not even a year so I was no where near experienced enough to mate and still am not. I don't even have a stable feeding routine down yet that I'm fully comfortable with so I wouldn't even try to have joeys.

Hello Leela,
I had a question about the BML diet. I was wondering where exactly you order yours from because I've heard there's more than one place to get it and I don't want to buy something that's not right. Also I was wondering was there anything else that had to be purchased along with it. I know with the suggie soup it calls for eggs, orange juice and several other things that I have to purchase to mix in with the powder. I was hoping that the BML isn't going to be too much more money than the suggie soup. Thanks so much.

It's a recipe you make at home, most of the ingredients are at the grocery store, 2 ingredients are at pet stores. So yes there is more than one place to get, you get most of it any grocery store you would normally shop at for yourself. The other 2 ingredients you can get at petsmart in the reptile section.

I order some of the ingredients online in bulk from Jet.com because I make bml so often some ingredients like the chicken baby food, and yogurt juice it's cheaper to buy in bulk by the case.

If you go to the bml website it shows pictures of all the ingredients in the recipe. http://www.bmldiet.com/bml-recipe.html

1/2 cup honey ( do not use raw or unfiltered honey )

1 4oz bottle premixed gerber yogrut juice

1/4 cup wheat germ ( refridgerate after opening)
1 teaspoon Rep-Cal Herptivite Muliti vitamin ( blue label )
can be found at petsmart

2 teaspoons Rep Cal non phosphourus with Vit. D3 ( pink Label ) can be found at petsmart

2 2 1/2oz jars of stage 1 or 2 beechnut, gerber or Heinz chicken baby food

1 hard boiled egg, do not use the shell

1/4 cup apple juice , normal adult applejuice.

1/2 cup dry baby cereal ( rice or oatmeal )

I looked up all the things you sent me and it's not that bad on cost so within the next week or so I'm going to switch to the BML. I have to wait so I have the extra money with the holidays things are a bit tight. I was wondering do you feed mealies to your babies if so do you buy them or have a farm because I don't but thought about starting either one? I'm not sure what's going on with my female glider but she's been waking the whole house up barking between 3am - 4am almost every morning. It's driving my husband crazy and the kids get upset lol. I've also noticed her fur has started getting that separated look to it which I've normally read and been told that it's not good and means they're usually missing something in their diet? I thought maybe it is the insects. I am scared of insects but if that's what they have to have I'll do it.

right on understandable with the holidays. I do feed mealies for either a morning treat or sometimes I reserve them for nail trimming days. I don't feed them after 3pm because my gliders won't eat their normal meal after filling up on mealies. I buy them at our local pet store up the road. We buy a few containers I put the extra's in the fridge so the meal worms go dormant until I need them. It also prevents them from morphing into aliens/beetles. Many people do farm them though.

Barking barking happens for many reasons, they want your attention, they hear something we can't hear, they are calling to a mate, they are giving the others a warning, they want treats, the moon phase, female in heat, sometimes for no reason at all other than they can. I can usually sleep through it my bf can't, and won't let me either he always thinks something is wrong and there is never anything wrong lol.

Cracked fur is nothing to be concerned about. It's cosmetic not nutritional. It is winter time and most folks are using furnaces or wood stoves to heat their homes which changes the humidity in the air. The humidity is usually the actual cause of cracked fur, you can pick up a humidifier for the room the gliders are in it should help.

The myth of cracked fur being nutritional came about with the hpw diets. It was a marketing tool to sell the diet, it was said the diet would fix cracked fur. Later on they publicly said cracked fur isn't diet related. But the community still preaches the inaccurate information.

I have a 1 year old brother and sister pair and every single night the female barks sometime between 12 and 5am. Except for once or twice she stops as soon as I go to check on them so it seems as though she's calling me to come play because as soon as she sees me she runs up to the bars. I make sure not to touch her or give her treats so that I don't encourage it, I just shine a light in to make sure they're both ok and go back to bed but it still happens every night and has just become part of being a glider parent

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