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Hissing at each other - is it dangerous? Please help.
Hissing at each other - is it dangerous? Please help.
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Jul 14 2017
07:25:15 PM
Hello everyone!
Three weeks ago me and my husband adopted a male glider - 3 months old. We didin't want him to feel lonley, so after a week we adopted a girl at the same age. We introduced them to one another and they were pretty good together. They sleep in one pouch, no problems with food (they only fight for extra snacks). But! They are hissing at each other quite a lot and sometimes I can see, that he grabs her head and bites a bit, for a moment or two, and then runs away; sometimes the girl bites his paws and also runs away. It's been a week since they live together.They sleep so peacfully together, and yet, such behavior... I stayed up three nights to make sure none of them will get hurt.
Is it normal? Or something I should be worried about?
Please excuse my poor English, it's not my first language :).
I would appreciate any help and advice... I'm worried :(.
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Jul 15 2017
12:25:01 AM
BYK_Chainsaw Face Hugger Visit BYK_Chainsaw's Photo Album BYK_Chainsaw's Journal USA 689 Posts
you dont say if you followed proper introductions procedures.
if you didnt do that, they could be having territory issues.

After we did introductions, even following the procedures, a few times we still had a few weeks of small squabbles with some of them.

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Jul 15 2017
05:43:48 AM
Sketchbook Starting Member 9 Posts
quote:
Originally posted by BYK_Chainsaw

you dont say if you followed proper introductions procedures.
if you didnt do that, they could be having territory issues.

After we did introductions, even following the procedures, a few times we still had a few weeks of small squabbles with some of them.





Thanks for the answer :).

They were introduced on neutral ground and had separate cages; on first day, they just played around, everything was fine. On the second day, my boy Freddie "invited" the girl, Francesca, to his cage (he lived in a big one, because this one was bought for two, as we wanted him to have a friend)- he sniffed her and went to cage, watching, is she is coming too. She came there with a little shy face, but he gave her food (that was SOO CUTE! He really brought her a piece of fruit!). On the third day, Freddie was really sad, when we wanted to take Francesca to her cage, so we changed the pouch to completely new one and watched, what will happen. The cage was open, so they walked in and out and jumped on us and all over the room, just playing. Then, they both crawled to the new pouch and just went to sleep! After about an hour they woke up, ate something and played along as best friends. We decided to leave them for the rest of the night in one cage (well, it was 4AM already...), since it was no problem for them.
They started to hiss at each other about two days ago. First, it was one hiss for ten minutes maybe... Now, it's getting stronger and louder. They are hissing even when they are outside, while jumping on us. When I say things like "What is the meaning of this?" in more harsh way, they stop and just look at me with those big eyes: Nothing, ABSOLUTELY nothing... But when I just turn around, they'll start the fight all over again.
Like I said, they sleep in one pouch, though they have another one in the cage, fresh one, just in case. They eat togehter with no problem. Only if we give the treat to one, the other is super jealous and they fight a bit.
They do not crabb (they NEVER made crabbing sound on us, but sometimes they bite us quite hard - I blame the fruit smell from our hands, we often take them out right after preparing food for them), they do not bark, they just make this...hissing. It sounds not too good. Maybe I'm overreacting...?

Sorry for such a long post, I wanted to explain everything as good as I can.
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Jul 15 2017
08:09:35 AM
TJones09 Goofy Gorillatoes Visit TJones09's Photo Album 3370 Posts
Im not familiar with joeys, but was wondering if Fressie is neutered (btw, love their names ). It could be the beginning of matting behavior. If that's not the case, it may be the establishment of heiarchy in their cage. If they're eating well (not food aggression) and sleeping well together, just watch for balling up fighting, not just a nip and run, and also making sure no wounds on either of them. If you notice wounds or injury or it gets worse, you will have to separate them for awhile at least, but hopefully not permanently.

Please do some research on mating behavior and other behaviors involving hissing (what serious fighting looks/sounds like).

Please also keep us posted with updates on how it's going and what you find out.

Oh, sorry I forgot my manners, Welcome to the forums, glad you found us!

Edited by - TJones09 on Jul 15 2017 08:11:24 AM
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Jul 15 2017
09:39:51 AM
Sketchbook Starting Member 9 Posts
quote:
Originally posted by TJones09

Im not familiar with joeys, but was wondering if Fressie is neutered (btw, love their names ). It could be the beginning of matting behavior. If that's not the case, it may be the establishment of heiarchy in their cage. If they're eating well (not food aggression) and sleeping well together, just watch for balling up fighting, not just a nip and run, and also making sure no wounds on either of them. If you notice wounds or injury or it gets worse, you will have to separate them for awhile at least, but hopefully not permanently.

Please do some research on mating behavior and other behaviors involving hissing (what serious fighting looks/sounds like).

Please also keep us posted with updates on how it's going and what you find out.

Oh, sorry I forgot my manners, Welcome to the forums, glad you found us!



Thank You for such a warm welcome and the advice :). I saw that You guys are really helpful here for newbies like me and have a great knowledge, so I registerded :).
As for the names . "Freddie" is a tribute to one of my favorite singers - Freddie Mercury. And Francesca... it was the first name on F that came into my mind .
I watched some videos about gliders behavior, and it seems, that Freddie boy is trying to mate (oh come on!!! He's still a baby!)... and Francesca is not happy about it, so she bites him :/. Freddie is not neutered, I was afraid, that he's to young for that. Now, I can see what he's doing - he tries to bite her back, she's running away and then, the fight begins...
Should I separate them in this case?
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Jul 15 2017
09:52:42 AM
TJones09 Goofy Gorillatoes Visit TJones09's Photo Album 3370 Posts
You're most welcome

I would consult with a vet, or maybe someone who has more experience with younger gliders. Mine were all older when I homed them. My guess would be to separate them if you don't want joeys, not sure if you're aware of their lineage. But perhaps someone can offer more advice, I know Freddie would be sad, and probably Francesca would be too, being separated.

Ah, yes Freddie Mercury fro Queen, a very talented artist, incredible talent! I have always enjoyed hearing him sing, love many songs from Queen.
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Jul 15 2017
12:42:05 PM
BYK_Chainsaw Face Hugger Visit BYK_Chainsaw's Photo Album BYK_Chainsaw's Journal USA 689 Posts
The introduction procedures I have read, if i remember correctly.

1. after neutral site introductions are successful have a CLEAN NEUTRAL CAGE with cage stuff ready. (we kept ours in a small PP cage in pouch while we cleaned the big cage as best as possible and put in new clean cage set) This way neither glider has a territory to defend.

2. Once gliders are happy together, Try not to SEPARATE. Pulling the gliders apart can cause them to experience lose of a great new friend.

info on website sugarglider.info/care/intros/

This website suggests separation if you think they will fight. Or to be around at night when they wake up see how they act.
My wife has mostly left them together. When she did a 6 + 2 gliders we let them sleep together for 3 nights but separated for the night because one was having difficulty accepting the new two. After 3 nights apart they were put together permanently. Usually we have some small squabbles after introductions.
The only one that failed was 7 gliders with 3 gliders. several of the 7 would not accept one of the three. after a week of them sleeping well together but having some chasing and almost fighting, we had to take sweet pea out.
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Jul 15 2017
02:52:03 PM
Sketchbook Starting Member 9 Posts
quote:
Originally posted by BYK_Chainsaw

The introduction procedures I have read, if i remember correctly.

1. after neutral site introductions are successful have a CLEAN NEUTRAL CAGE with cage stuff ready. (we kept ours in a small PP cage in pouch while we cleaned the big cage as best as possible and put in new clean cage set) This way neither glider has a territory to defend.

2. Once gliders are happy together, Try not to SEPARATE. Pulling the gliders apart can cause them to experience lose of a great new friend.

info on website sugarglider.info/care/intros/

This website suggests separation if you think they will fight. Or to be around at night when they wake up see how they act.
My wife has mostly left them together. When she did a 6 + 2 gliders we let them sleep together for 3 nights but separated for the night because one was having difficulty accepting the new two. After 3 nights apart they were put together permanently. Usually we have some small squabbles after introductions.
The only one that failed was 7 gliders with 3 gliders. several of the 7 would not accept one of the three. after a week of them sleeping well together but having some chasing and almost fighting, we had to take sweet pea out.




That's it, I do not know, if they are happy together, if they act like that... Today I heard them hissing at the pouch. But when I looked there, they were just just staring at me with "What?" signed on their faces. It might sound funny, but they were calm again, when I turned the "Forrest sounds" music on .
So You are saying we made a mistake with that cage... well, someone, who we thought is experienced in gliders told us to do so. Oh my :(.
They run together in perfect harmony in a wheel or sometimes just sit next to each other and lick their paws. These are the times, when I think everything is ok. But then I walk out of the room and the hissing party begins...
The thing is, they do not chase one another. They just sometimes... I don't know, going loony tooney, may I say that? I'm really worried then. But when Francesca is not arround (for example she'll jump on me when he's not looking), Freddie is shaking, running like crazy and looking in every single corner.
So I'm really torn now... :(.
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Jul 15 2017
02:53:53 PM
Sketchbook Starting Member 9 Posts
quote:
Originally posted by TJones09

You're most welcome

I would consult with a vet, or maybe someone who has more experience with younger gliders. Mine were all older when I homed them. My guess would be to separate them if you don't want joeys, not sure if you're aware of their lineage. But perhaps someone can offer more advice, I know Freddie would be sad, and probably Francesca would be too, being separated.

Ah, yes Freddie Mercury fro Queen, a very talented artist, incredible talent! I have always enjoyed hearing him sing, love many songs from Queen.



Thank You for all Your help and support!
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Jul 15 2017
06:44:16 PM
Sketchbook Starting Member 9 Posts
UPDATE: I know what is happening. I've been sitting in front of the cage for hours today. They are fighting over... a branch!
There are branches in the cage, quite a lot of them, made to imitate a tree (all are glider safe). There is one branch, higher than the others. They are fighting, who will sit there! If Freddie sits there, Francesca goes wild and they hiss at each other for some time. If Francesca sits there, Freddie wants to push her out or even... sits on her! And we have a fight...
Tomorrow we will make the second branch, at the same height as the first one. They will have two of them. I hope this will setlle all issues.
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Jul 16 2017
07:04:47 AM
TJones09 Goofy Gorillatoes Visit TJones09's Photo Album 3370 Posts
I do hope so, but I'd still consult a vet for when to neuter Freddie.

I have some hiss, crab, chase going on with my trio. Ollie started this a few months after moving in with the girls shortly after getting them a new cage a few years ago. I just recently got them a new cage again and he was on good behavior for the first few weeks, but I have begun to here him act up every so often this past week. It's nothing serious, he will chance the girls away, hissing and crabbing from a f/v feeding station, no contact is made. I think this happens when the green bean count is low, lol, he seems to get possessive over a favorite vegetable. No worries though, even though I can't stand hearing discontent, and I do feel bad for the girls, they are both bigger than him and are rather "fluffy" so I'm not concerned they aren't getting food. I had thought they have taken food from him in the past and now he won't tolerate them near him when eating, but this isn't every time, he will at other times eat nicely with them.

Please let us know how the second, high branch goes.
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Jul 26 2017
06:53:14 AM
Sketchbook Starting Member 9 Posts
Hello everyone, so here is the update:
The "branch thing" failed :(. They started to fight EVEN MORE. I do not even know, who is responsible for all this drama... I mean, which one: Freddie or Francesca. We gave them two pouches, but they were still sleeping in one and HISSING LIKE CRAZY! Today I saw that Francesca threw Freddie out of the pouch - he was sitting outside on the branch and shaking. He had the other pouch, but still wanted to go back to her!!! Now that's what I call toxic relationship :/.
We have a new cage. They will be separate for some time. This is my last hope... I hope, after pouch swapping and all that jazz, they will at kast get along... If not, I do not know, what I'll do :(. I'm devastated...
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Jul 26 2017
08:42:00 AM
Leela Goofy Gorillatoes Gliderpedia Editor Visit Leela's Photo Album Leela's Journal 2423 Posts
have they been to the vet for wellness and fecal exams?
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Jul 26 2017
09:03:21 AM
Sketchbook Starting Member 9 Posts
quote:
Originally posted by Leela

have they been to the vet for wellness and fecal exams?




They had wealthcheck just before the adoption, the previous owners did that. Should I take them now? Can all this be caused by some health problems?
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Jul 26 2017
09:49:56 AM
Leela Goofy Gorillatoes Gliderpedia Editor Visit Leela's Photo Album Leela's Journal 2423 Posts
I'd take em in and def have fecals done. I would do one set of fecals then a second fecal in 30 days.

The reason for 2 is sometimes parasites don't show up in the first fecal, depending on what stage the parasite is in.

and yes the behavior could be related to medical issues.

If one isn't feeling well it might go after the other to keep it away.

Or if one isn't feeling well the other can sense it's ill and will try to get rid of it to "protect the colony" or itself.

There are many potential possibilities for their behavior so the safest thing is to first rule out medical issues and parasites. If both fecals and exams go well then address environmental and other possibilities.



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Jul 26 2017
05:58:19 PM
Sketchbook Starting Member 9 Posts
quote:
Originally posted by Leela

I'd take em in and def have fecals done. I would do one set of fecals then a second fecal in 30 days.

The reason for 2 is sometimes parasites don't show up in the first fecal, depending on what stage the parasite is in.

and yes the behavior could be related to medical issues.

If one isn't feeling well it might go after the other to keep it away.

Or if one isn't feeling well the other can sense it's ill and will try to get rid of it to "protect the colony" or itself.

There are many potential possibilities for their behavior so the safest thing is to first rule out medical issues and parasites. If both fecals and exams go well then address environmental and other possibilities.







Thank You so much for the advice, I'll do that ASAP. According to the information I have from previous owners, both "kids" are healthy, byt it's better to check.
Anyway, we had to separate them for tonight. They were hissing and crabbing like crazy in the pouch, this was nothing like I heard before. They finally got out and took the fight outside. I was so scared that they would hurt each other... Now I can hear Freddie is barking a bit. The cages are standing right next to each other, so they can hear and see one another. I do not know, maybe it will help? I hope so... I'm so worried about them.
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Hissing at each other - is it dangerous? Please help.

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Hissing at each other - is it dangerous? Please help.