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Posted by:	Springer
Subject:	Just got back from the vet...
When:	1:16 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	24.129.186.237

Hello all!
I just got back from the vet. He was INCREDIBLY nice even though it was just a check up. The one thing I was a bit curious about was where his scent gland on the top of his head was. It looked like it had this fungus thing on it or something. Well, I signed in and waited. A LOT of people there didn't even know what a sugarglider was so they were happy to look at him and pet him. I love him so much. The vet asked if he bites and I said, "Well he never bites me" and the vet just laughed and hoped he wouldn't get bit. Of course, he didn't and complemented on how tame and sweet he was though he kept trying to get in the vet's shirt. Ha ha ha... The vet picked all that clumpy stuff off his scent gland and it looked like he was literally bald right there. The vet noticed a little puncture wound and said that it seaped out liquid and that dried up creating the clumpy stuff. He put his head under a blacklight to see if it would glow, and that would indicate ringworm or something like that. Nothing, but it was a little infected so he gave me stuff called "Panalog Cream." He said to apply it twice a day for about 7-10 days and his hair should start growing back. I'm only concerned about that cream cause on the box it says "FOR TOPICAL USE ON DOGS AND CATS ONLY" He is a vet, and he knows a lot, so I'm trusting that it's good for him, right? The ingredients read: Nystatin 100,000 units, Neomycin Sulfate equivalent to neomycin base 2.5 mg, Thiostrepton 2,500 units, Triamcinolone Acetonide 1mg
So in conclusion, that is alright for gliders, correct? Thanks for all/any help!

Follow Ups:

Posted by:	Bourbon
Subject:	none
When:	1:33 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	216.248.35.118

NO do NOT USE IT...
It is his scent gland, tat is what it is supposed to do, the "puncture wound is his gland, the seepage is the scenting stuff.
His hair is NOT supposed to grow back ..

Posted by:	Cristina, cristinahelms@hotmail.com
Subject:	none
When:	3:27 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	167.127.24.18

It sounds like your vet is very nice but not too experienced with gliders, I would try calling around and asking other vets if they have experience with gliders. You can always go to glider central (www.sugarglider.net) and see if they have any vets listed in your area.

Posted by:	Mary/Beck, intr01dc@frank.mtsu.edu
Subject:	none
When:	3:33 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	12.77.81.183

He is supposed to have a bald spot there..its his scent gland. The stuff comming out of it is normal. Please do not put anything on it. Your vet does sound nice, but well really needs to learn a lot about gliders. Had they ever seena glider ebfore? All mature males have this unless neutered.

Posted by:	Jenga
Subject:	none
When:	4:04 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	24.129.186.222

Well i don't see why it cant' hurt.

Posted by:	Springer
Subject:	none
When:	4:05 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	24.129.186.237

I'm not sure I completely agree with you all. I mean, the stuff was clumping together, not like it normally does, and it did look infected. Now he is completely bald there, and he doesn't look like he normally does. Anyway, what is wrong with the medication he gave me? It could help the infection. And he did know what a sugarglider was because he said he saw another recently and that sucker bit him, hard, so he is experienced. Something was not right with his scent gland though... Not right at all. It had this dark brown/green stuff, so you guys are telling me that's normal? Please...

Posted by:	Hector
Subject:	none
When:	4:21 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	24.129.186.222

I would listen to your Vet. He knows best. Besides, it's just a little medication. It's meant to help. If you see no change in it when you put the medication on, then don't worry about it. If anything, it will help more than harm him.

Posted by:	Springer
Subject:	none
When:	4:28 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	24.129.186.237

It is just a little medication and he is a vet, so he should know best. I don't see how you guys can say so FIRMLY not to use it, when you haven't even seen it? You assume it's just a scent gland but did you see all that icky stuff that WAS on it until the vet cleaned him up. I think I should just listen to the vet and not listen to these posts only to get second guessed.

Posted by:	Bourbon
Subject:	none
When:	5:03 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	216.248.35.161

Jenga and Hector, I am going to assume, that your both fairly new if Not my apologies, the fact he said the hair would grow back, is something worth just looking at ..
ALL males have bald spots, they hair is RUBBED off, as the gliders rub their scent gland over their territory. or their mate. Which tells, me that another vet is in order. To give the advice just because they are vets, doesn't mean they know about gliders.just because they had seen one doesn't mean they are knowledgable. Springer, you came in asking a question, it was answered by people who ARE glider knowledgable, all of us have helped educate vets. But you do what you wish, the crusty on top is normal for males, a warm washcloth, helps with that. But please consider something, although, a vet, doesn't mean glider knowledgable vet. I would be seriously worried at this point. here is my email, you can send me your vets name and phone number and I can speak with him as well. bourbon@iname.com
If not oh well do as you wish..

Posted by:	Kimi, norby@greenepa.net
Subject:	none
When:	5:12 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	209.117.80.133

Was there an actual wound on the bald spot? If so I believe neosporine would take care any infection. I have to check but Im sure I read a post on GC that said neosprine (sp) is ok to use, however theres like 5 different kinds of it now and Im not sure wich one...I will go check a coupla places and make sure that it is in fact safe to use. Nobody here would give you any kind of advice that would intentionally hurt you or your glider. Bourbon has much more experience than I and she has done years of research, there must be something in your meds that can be harmful.
When Gilbert first arrived here his bald spot was much like you say yours is, it cleared up after a week of staying in a clean cage and eating the proper types food, I am not sayin your cages are dirty or your foods inadequate, I am simply relating my incounter with this prob.I have also read a few posts about gliders that neglect to clean themselves because they are unhappy about something.
Anyway, I am going to go check on the neo stuff and I will let you know what I find out.
wishing you and your glider the very best.... Kimi

Posted by:	Kimi, norby@greenepa.net
Subject:	none
When:	5:21 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	209.117.80.133

Oops Bourbons last post wasnt up when I posted this, Please disregard my previous post and get a hold of Bourbon

Posted by:	Springer
Subject:	none
When:	6:08 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	24.129.186.237

I just called another vet and she said go right ahead... So I did. It didn't burn him and he acted like it wasn't even on him. Now, an hour later, it looks like it did before so it must have "sunk in" or something... I don't recall the vets number, Bourbon. I'll look it up later maybe...

Posted by:	Jim M
Subject:	none
When:	6:49 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	12.75.178.168

Springer,
I think that the people here were trying to give you good advice and I think you are missing the point. You seem to want to put your vet on the "know-all" pedestal and I agree with the others that they do not know everything, just as MD's do not know everything (plus the fact that most specialize in a certain field, just as most vets do). If this vet saw another glider besides your glider, it doesn't mean he is knowledgeble about them. I am sure he thought he did what is best, but the fact remains that you had doubts about it. Perhaps, you should get another vet. There are alot of meds that vets give (that say "for dogs and cats only") to other animals, so do not be freaked by that. Those warnings are put on the labels, so people do not use them on themselves. As far as the "gunk" in the scent gland, I have never seen it in my boys. However, I have a thoroughbred horse who is prone to get gunk in her tear duct (on her left eye) and I put a little topical gentocin in it. I had to be the one to tell the vet not to give her an antibiotic shot because it was not needed. While I am an infectious disease epidemiologist, I do not claim to know everything about infectious diseases. I do know that my horse probably needed an antihistamine shot, NOT an IM shot of penicillin. Just keep an open mind Springer and realize that the people here are your allies and not your enemies. Most importantly, the number one thing is your glider's health!

Posted by:	Springer
Subject:	none
When:	6:58 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	24.129.186.237

Yeah, I can understand the part about giving advice, but how can someone say something so SURELY and FIRMLY about something that I only described? They haven't visually seen it, yet they didn't suggest, they TOLD. That is the part that doesn't sit right with me.

The med is a LITTLE bit of antibiotic, so maybe that's enough to clear the infection. Who knows... I'll see in the morning...

Posted by:	O Mysterious One, none
Subject:	none
When:	7:12 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	216.46.140.186

Maybe you could post a picture (if you have a website it would be easy), so that we can see if it is any differnet than normal.
Or if somebody else here has a picture of what a male's bald spot typically looks like that could help ya.

Posted by:	Jim M
Subject:	none
When:	7:17 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	12.75.178.168

Hey, I can understand, but most of these people have had experiences with their gliders, so they are just passing on what they know. You do not have to do what they say, that is why it is advice. Also, just for your information, the first three ingredients are antibiotics and the fourth is a corticosteroid (immune suppressor), so the medication does pack a punch. If you want more specifics, nystatin is an antifungal. Finally, a gentleman posted similar symptoms with his male and his vet said it probably resulted from him rubbing on the cage. The rubbing probably stimulated the gland, thus producing an over-secretion. It is good to be safe! Drive on!!

Posted by:	Angela, angelaisme@home.com
Subject:	whoa
When:	7:30 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	152.163.204.204

whoa! chill out Springer! Bourbon just said it firmly because she thought it was harful & didnt want your glider to get sick. I respect Bourbon & ive only been watching this board for a day but a can tell she is well informed on sugar gliders & for that i respect her opinion. You dont have to get so defensive. As Jim said that stuff packs a punch & are you totally sure your vet knows what hes doing? If you were you wouldnt have posted the question in the first place. Just calm down the people here are trying to help & they know alot. k? -Angela

Posted by:	Mary/Beck, intr01dc@frank.mtsu.edu
Subject:	none
When:	7:31 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	12.77.81.141

Yes it is perfectly normal for the males to get it gunky just as you desctibed..this happens in mature males all the time. As bourbon said all you have to do is use a warm wash cloth to clean it when this happens.

Posted by:	Angela, angelaisme@home.com
Subject:	whoa
When:	7:34 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	152.163.204.204

Posted by:	Springer
Subject:	none
When:	8:21 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	24.129.186.237

Terribly sorry everyone, but I do get defensive and I have a habit of making it known. A dear "friend" of mine also had a sugarglider. They played together and had a lot of fun. Then, my friend's died... Died right in my hand on the way to the vet. The vet had no sympathy, but rather then inform me of what went wrong, the vet yelled at me. I did not like that vet very much after that point. So, when I went to the new vet he was much kinder and SEEMED like he knew what he was talking about. I just don't want mine to die. That's all... That's all I ask...

My vet seemed like he made sence. There was a little puncture on his scent gland, and he showed me it. I did not notice that before, maybe cause all that junk was there, so I went with it. Do all males have a little "dot" where their scent gland is? I'm worried... That's all... He cleaned it up so it looks a lot better... That little dot just didn't look right... I'm just afraid... I don't want to lose him...

And yes, someone did have a similar post, and they said it was cause theirs was rubbing his head on the cage... That's what mine said. He said he probably rubbed his head on something and it punctured... Then stuff seaped out(not the regular scent stuff) and it created the clumpy stuff... I don't know...

Posted by:	Angela, angelaisme@home.com
Subject:	none
When:	9:14 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	24.4.254.161

why did my post be done twice? i didnt do it twice. anyways, very bad first Vet! i wouldve yelled right back at him! its ok Springer

Posted by:	Kerry, gryphon214@aol.com
Subject:	none
When:	10:27 PM, 27 Dec 2000
IP:	64.12.104.31

Just a thought, but perhaps the reason the ointment said "for cats and dogs only" was because it has not been tested to be safe on humans? Getting any drug approved for use on humans is an expensive and time consuming process, it's cheaper to just put a warning label on something meant only for pets.

PLEASE no lectures on how it might not have been tested on sugar gliders and thus be unsafe for them, etc . . I know this could be true, I was just pointing out a major reason why it would have been labled that way. It could just be some mild, topical antibiotic that few or no animals would have a reaction to and maybe the vet knows this?

Kerry

Posted by:	collette, a412@webtv.net
Subject:	none
When:	7:52 AM, 28 Dec 2000
IP:	209.240.221.70

when i got my males nuetered, their hair "grew" back, it never really left, the bald spot was illusional cos the scent oil made it look wet an thinner. it never looked green or crusty. now i only have two males and one was nuetered at 4 months so i'm no expert. i leave expert advice to bourbon and the other old timers on this site. vets can learn alot from them and they can learn a lot from the vets. i think those that tell you don't use the cream (i'm sure exotics weren't mentioned cos they are still "rare", after all it didn't mention monkeys lizards or giraffes on the label either.) are only going by the theory "when in doubt,don't". we only worry about the little guys and just want to help. let bourbon talk to the vet or get some other advice but i don't the ointment will hurt on top of the head. wash his hands so every so ofter so he doesn't lick to much of it.

Posted by:	Barb, blooprints@yahoo.com
Subject:	none
When:	11:52 AM, 28 Dec 2000
IP:	63.180.14.211

You sound smart enough to make a common sense decision for yourself. Everyone agrees that mature male gliders have a bald spot; my males' spots always look "greasy," and I only have one who occasionally will get crusty. Quite frankly, I'd be concerned if my glider had oozing green gunk - that did not sound good. It sounds like you did a wise thing in trying a vet. (I think I'd have tried removing the green gunk with a little warm water on a wash cloth to see if that cleared things up first....I'm a chicken when it comes to taking the wee ones to the vet unless it is absolutely necessary.) Good luck. I know you only wanted what was best for your little fella. Sometimes people are too overpowering when they mean to be helpful....I've only been at this site about a month but have been raising gliders for nearly 5 years...If I had followed some advice "offered" in the beginning, my gliders wouldn't be as healthy and happy as they are today. I do believe people here mean well and want what is best for gliders, but what you do is your decision. (This also means that the wrong decision can have dire consequences.) Good luck!

Posted by:	Jasmine, Spookie_Girl@yahoo.com
Subject:	none
When:	4:08 PM, 28 Dec 2000
IP:	63.78.31.223

I noticed Murry's head clumped mostly when he first hit puberty. It was just like a scab, and when the clump came off he had a baldspot. He never had too many other problems with it clumping up afterwards, but kept the baldspot until I had him neutered.

Springer - What I'm wondering is was your vet actually surprised there was a baldspot? Did he know that sugar gliders have a gland there?

If he didn't know these things, then I really would suggest you find another vet. A friendly vet is super important, but it's even more important to have one who is knowledgable and will go out of the way to do some research on his/her patients. We had a vet for my sister's ferret who was very friendly, and wonderful with our dogs. To our surprise though, he knew very little about ferrets and ended up KILLING her ferret by giving him a canine distemper shot rather than a feline distemper shot. I'd be even more careful of finding a glider vet, since gliders are not as popular and are marsupials (unusualy reproductive systems).

My current glider vet knew about gliders before I brought Murry in. He wrote some articles on them and dealt with some in zoos. Murry was his first sugar glider patient that was actually a pet. Even though my vet had plenty of experience neutering other small animals, he never neutered a sugar glider. He went out of his way to research the best method and thoroughly read about the procedure, called a well-seasoned glider vet in NY to discuss it, and instructed to his staff about what to expect before they performed the operation. Murry (and his son, Loki) are now both happy and healthy.

He's also not afraid to admit when he's not sure about something, and NEVER jumps into treating an animal until he knows what's really wrong with it. If I didn't have him as my vet, I'm sure my little Zelda would have died from a urinary tract infection. That is the kind of vet EVERYONE should have!

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