Hello community.

I am a new parent of a joey and have had him for a little over a week. I understand that most people say I need a second glider so he has company. But, I would like to work with this one first and then possibly add to his colony.

My glider does chatter when he is in the pouch, but never makes any noise once he is awake and I hang out with him by the cage. I do feed him treats through the bars and he has been taking them. Sometimes he runs up to the edge of the cage when I walk up. I usually put my hand up and he doesnt run, but sniffs. Sometimes I put my (clean) hands up to the cage and he will sometimes sniff, scratch with his teeth, nibble and he has drawn blood once.

Since I dont take him out of his pouch when I hold him while he sleeps(should I?), I was trying to think of other ways to desensitize him to hands in specific. I know he will eventually warm up since I give him food.

But, here is my idea/question. I found these latex hand props. I was thinking about putting one in his cage as a hammock of sorts.

Is latex something that would be safe for him to be on on case he scratches and/or bites it at first? I could possibly wrap it in beige microfiber fleece or glove.

Good idea? Bad idea? Thanks in advance for the feedback!

Pictures would help, we can't say one way or the other if it's safe without seeing it. Latex in itself is safe and often used yes, but that doesn't mean whatever it is is safe or not.

Sorry, didnt think a picture would really be any help or necessary for my question. It is really just a latex question. I have attached what I did find online. I havent exactly found something I would definitely buy as of yet.

Let me know what you think.


find online.

are they hollow/open at the wrist end like a glove??

If it's hollow or open at the end, No I wouldn't use it in a cage, especially if the glider is relatively new to you. If the glider goes in them you'd play hell getting it back out of it if you needed to.

If it's solid with no way to get inside it....... it'd be an awesome toy and yeh if hung right and safely, a glider could curl up in the hand ( if it's hollow the glider will always go inside it rather than lay on top in the hand )

Dremel tool, drill some holes, use zipties and plastic chain, or fleece to hang it.

I'd think if you wrap it with anything it would defeat the purpose of them in the first place, which is getting them desensitized to real hands.

Latex things usually have a smell to them, It'd need washed a few times probably, then you could use some dirty clothes of yours to rub on it so it smells like you too.

Pictures alwaysssss help and allow us to give better advice

Well, I found the exact same hands on Amazon. But, they say they are solid, closed off and are made of plastic.(100% polyester) is this okay? They do not have much give to them. Which I would imagine is fine.

Ok, I looked them up, I was thinking they were life size, not finger puppet size. Being that they are this small, I don't think it will help with getting the glider used to your hands... as a toy part, you could use it like a charm on a toy I spose.

The ones I found are life sized. For props/mannequins. Here is the link. I did see those too. I dont think they would serve the same purpose... haha.

Forum Novelties Men's Prop Stage Hands, Nude, One Size www.amazon.com/dp/B000IUQKDI/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_BoHvBb0BFZYBT

ahhh ty ok right on... I don't see why you couldn't use those for that then!! from the reviews they seem pretty solid, and should hold up to making a glider safe hanging toy and size wise much more comparable to life size hands

Like anything you put in the cage, monitor it for any wear n tare if it really gets chewed up remove it and replace it..

Great. Tha k you for your help. I will definitely get pictures once I get it up in the cage and see if he starts laying or hanging on it. I will keep it with me or just throw it in the laundry basket wrapped in my shirt for a few hours after I wash it. It will be interesting to see how he reacts.

Do you think it would be better to hang it while he is awake, or let him wake up to it there? I dont want to startle him.

I'd let him wake up to it, if he doesn't come out to check it out when you put it in lol some of mine knowwwwww when I put knew things in the cage during the day and come out to check it out then go back to bed... some don't come out and check it out when they wake up at night.

Laundry basket would prolly work the best

I would be interested to see how this works out. This actually sounds like a genius idea! Please post your experience !

Update: So far I have the mannequin hand in the lower corner of his cage. It is suspended by plastic chains just enough to keep it from moving. His first reaction to it was curiousity. But he did try and nibble the finger tips and stopped when there was no give. He also climbed all over it giving it a few kicks.

I have been leaving snacks for him to find when he wakes up each night in the palm and sometimes when cleaning his cage or changing food/water he would actually run to the hand instead of climb all over the place. I would say he is used to it being there.

Now, I do not have much proof that it is desensitizing him to hands because I havent handled him. However, I still have been putting my hands to the cage when he walks up to me. He did stop biting me through the cage. He only scratched his teeth on me once in the past two days instead of every time trying to bite. Is that progress? Some might think so. But, I think the real test is when I take him out for his first tent time to see if he gets near my hands without biting or being too hand shy.

Question: for someone just starting tent time and have not had him out of his cage with the exception of in his pouch... What is the best way to do tent time? Just take him out while he is in the pouch before he wakes up? Also, what is the easiest way to corral him for getting back to the cage? I guess the real question is, should I be doing tent time or waiting a little longer. I have had him for 3 weeks. My bonding time is through the pouch when I get home from work (about 1-2 hours), a couple of hours at night through the cage and about 30 minutes in the morning before he goes to sleep.

He does approach me when i come up to the cage and just look at me. (Probably 1/3 of the time I have food) Would you say that is a sign he knows who I am and is starting to "bond"?

Thanks!

Awesome sounds like he likes it and has deemed it a safe spot.

Tent time... you may get different opinions on when to do tent time as it varies for everyone depending on their lifestyle and their gliders.

For me, everything I do with my gliders out of the cage is done during the day time, for a few reasons.

They are more docile, slower, and in most cases easier to handle. It's usually easier to get them back in a pouch and back in the cage also.

Night time at my house, is their free time. Once I put their food in the cage between 8 n 9pm, the gliders I have out go back in the cage and I'm done getting them out for any kind of bonding time. It's their down time, their time to eat, run on the wheel, groom, nap, etc... all their favorite stuff is in the cage... I don't like to interfere with any of that.

I typically only use a tent for gliders that aren't familiar with me and were trimming nails and developing our routine, once the glider is used to me, the routine and is no longer a flight risk and stays on me the majority of the time I no longer use a tent.

When I'm working with a new glider ( at any age ) I usually get them out of the cage around 10 or 11 am, I just take their sleep pouch out with them in it.

Once in the tent I sit in my lap and give them a treat, trim nails n check them over... once all nails are trimmed I just roll the pouch down, push the bottom of the pouch up so the gliders are right at the top and want to come out because they are already exposed. Then usually they are either off and running or trying to get back in the pouch.

For the first few times I don't let them back in the pouch, I tuck it under one of my legs, so they can smell it on me but not have access to it.

Keep in mind the whole point of tent time is to get them used to coming to you, checking you out, getting used to how you move and smell and sound and eventually staying on you all on their own terms. So keeping their sleep pouch on you, in your clothes, or under a leg will help draw them to you.

Besides the nail trimmings I don't initiate interactions with them, I watch tv or do something online and ignore them for the most part UNLESS they come to me, if they come to me or on me that is when I pay attention to them, talk to them, pet them, offer them my sleeve etc... if they leave me I go back to ignoring them.


It's important to note, my house is pretty dark even during the day time, limit bright lights when you have them out of the cage or they won't be very active and will seek out the darkest place to hang out and avoid you.

It's also important to note, a tent session for me is usually about a half hour long, at that point they are tired out, had snacks n ready to go back to sleep. I do not force them to stay up during the day, when they are ready they get their pouch back.

If it seemed to stress the gliders, they go back to the cage to destress where they feel most comfortable. If they didn't get stressed they may stay either in my lap or in my shirt for the rest of the day while they sleep. It depends on the gliders...

If you have trouble collecting them to go back to the cage.... get the sleep pouch ready, turn on a light and offer them the pouch. Most often they will voluntarily go in the pouch without you chasing them. Just hold the pouch close to them and let them go in. This is a greatttttt thing to get in the habit of doing, if you ever have a glider get out of the cage, and you WILL, it's easiest and less stressful to them and you if they are in the routine of going in the sleep pouch when it's offered. The sleep pouch should be their 1 safety spot, use it as a tool.

Once the gliders I'm working with are more interested in me than running around, I spend a few more days in the tent with the gliders in their sleep pouch in my lap. They have the option to run around, but most don't. At that point I work on offering them my sleeve. I wear a long sleeve shirt or sweatshirt with the cuff a bit loose so they can see the opening. I make a fist, and put the bottom of the cuff in their pouch and usually they will go up in it on their own. Once the first one does usually the 2nd will follow even if he/she didn't think they wanted to.

Once they go in my sleeve, or stay on me completely I'm done with the tent and it's served it's purpose for me.

I don't bring any glider toys in the tent, to me it's just a distraction for them and it's counter productive to what I'm working towards.

Other people set their tents up like a giant cage, with toys and wheels and all kinds of stuff.. which isn't really wrong if they are just giving the gliders a bigger play space where they can play with them.

As I said, I do tent time during the day, your schedule may not allow that, just do it as early as you can, it doesn't have to be during the day, but at night it may be harder for you to collect the glider and get it back to it's cage. The glider will be WIDE awake and may not be so eager to voluntarily go back in it's pouch even if a light is turned on.

You've had him for about 3 weeks now is a perfect time to start tent time with him.

Since you're already spending a half hour or so with him in the morning that could be a great time to do tent time because he will be ready to go to bed and would probably easily go in the pouch since that is already getting tired and his routine to go to bed at that time . But if you have to leave for work give yourself a few min extra in case it takes longer to get him in the pouch so your not late to work...

How old is he?

is he neutered or intact?

both could have a little to do with nibbling or biting is why I'm asking and should have asked before.

I think that you are on the right track with bonding but I am of the opinion that gliders are never 100% bonded to you. I think the bonding process is a constant growing process not like a dog that is mostly loyal from the first day. I got my boys at 6 mths old and was worried about bonding because they had been hand raised by their breeder but it just made them more easily handled. They were really scared for a while. Everything is new and different and smells and sounds different in your home.

After the 2nd month i really thought my boys would never bond with me. I have one that loves to bite everything. He's part piranha or puppy I swear. He was constantly biting my fingers and toes and even ears but did it while playing so I figured out that was his way of interacting. He has slowly stopped biting my hands and his brother hard but it took patience and constant correction.

For tent time I started out taking their whole pouch with them in it as soon as they started to stir. Now I just open the cage after they're awake and they each dive onto me and then I get in the tent. I used to bring 2 zip up pouches in to the tent to catch them to return to the cage. Now I only have to catch Dale in a pouch and unzip the tent on the cage side and Chip jumps to it and goes right in. I only bring a few toys and treats into the tent and I used to bring my kindle but they are too curious and keep jumping on it and changing the pages. It seems the more I ignore them the more they want me. This past week Dale has been climbing into my hood and grooming himself and then napping. Chip has started to put his hands on my face if I'm trying to read, then he climbs down my shirt and out my sleeve and around again. I never though they would let me get that close but as long as I only pet them and don't grab at them they're good. They respond to my voice when I say their names a lot now when they're out. I tried using different tones with each of them so they would get to know their names.

I will say that their attention span is a lot like a kitten. If Dale (my piranha) is trying to chew on something he shouldn't (like the tent) I can distract him with a toy in about 2 seconds. Chip is my watcher and likes to be up high. He has never bitten me once and climbs onto my hands to "help" me get his brother into a pouch or unzip the tent. He's definitely the older brother type.

Enjoy this time getting to know your baby and don't fret. Patience is key. You seem to be doing all of the right things. Also search for everything you have questions about on this site. Somebody has probably already asked or mentioned something you are unsure of. Everyone will have an opinion but you need to follow your gut too.

Edit: Leela is a great resource and has great advice! I wish I was able to have my gliders as close to me as hers are. Maybe eventually I won't need the tent.

Hey, that is great information to build my own methods off of. I beleive he was about 10 weeks oop when I got him. And have had him 3 weeks now. He is not neutered and I do not think I am going to do it. I have 3 other male pets. All nuetered.

I am thinking I will do tent time right when I get home from work. About 5pm. Much earlier on the weekend. So. He should still be groggy and slowed down. I'm thinking every other day. Unless you think daily is best for quicker results?

I 100% agree that gliders are never 100% "bonded" to you. It is ever changing, evolving, growing, for the duration of your relationship with that glider.

Even when you THINK you hit a wall and that is where the 'bond' seems stuck at... they will surprise and progress even further. It's like any other friendship you establish, the longer you are in that relationship, the deeper the connection grows.

Two big things are... don't have any expectations of your glider and don't compare your "bond" with your glider to anyone else's or even other gliders you own yourself, they are individuals so each relationship is individual and unique to that glider.

If you have expectations you will be disappointed. If you put a time frame on it, you will be frustrated. Every glider human relationship is different. What I do with mine, may not work for you. What I can do with my gliders depends on each glider.


Your boy is very young and may hit another nibbling biting stage as he matures, especially since he is intact. He probably hasn't hit sexual maturity yet which can happen anytime at this point, but usually around 4 months old.

I'm in the minority as I say this, single gliders can do ok for awhile.

Having said that, choosing to keep him intact just for the sake of keeping him intact could bite you in the a$$ later on if he shows signs that he needs a cage mate.

Gliders aren't like other pets like dogs or cats when it comes to being around other intact males. Gliders are territorial, male and female, intact males ups it even more usually.

Your options for potential cage mates will be very limited. If you don't have lineage on him, ethically, female cage mates are off the table or you risk potential inbreeding ( regardless of where you buy the gliders )

Other intact males will make for difficult introductions which could result in injuries or in worst case scenarios death ( I don't usually throw the death card around but it is a realistic possibility in this case) . A neutered male cage mate can be introduced to intact males but there is still risk involved and it's easier if both are neutered, even then it may not work.

There is risk involved with ANY intro, it's a higher risk with intact males.

You can always neuter later on, but then you have about a month to wait for hormones to reduce before you can proceed with intros safely.

Neutering also mellows males out and reduces their smell. Some intact males reek and are verrrrrrrrrry pungent. He may not smell now, but as he comes closer to sexual maturity, his body is going to start producing hormones, and his scent glands are going to kick into gear... then his strength of smell is going to change.


I'm not saying you "have to neuter!!!" I'm just giving you information that you may not have been aware of when you initially settled on that decision.



Back to tent time,
every other day is fine, 5pm is fine, earlier on weekends is fine.

Personally I don't feel every day is necessary in most cases. But consider he is single, and you are his only buddy right now. If I have singles I'm working with I try to take them out more often until I get them in with a colony, at that point they really don't need me they have the colony.

I can say that, and easily do that, since I don't go to work lol I have all day every day and most people can not fit in as much "bonding time' as I am able to.

So I'm saying, get to know him, and use your best judgement, if it seems he really enjoys it and needs it try to do it as often as you can.

Even if it's just bonding bag time that is more often with him, that is just as effective and important as tent time and often times the least stressful in my opinion.

ChipandDalesMom ty for that and pleaseee know I have more time than the average owner does to dedicate to the gliders. I don't work outside of the house, I don't have children here, I don't have other pets. I am home a lone for about 12 hours a day.

None of my gliders are at the same stage, some will stay on me no matter what I do but not all of that is strictly from how I "bond" with them or how much or how little time I spent with them. Some of them are older and naturally mellow, some of them have had medical issues and through treatment the bond developed deeper, some were born here and have known me since birth.

and I have others that won't stay on me as well and come out of my shirt if I get more active than just sitting here with them. They get curious, or smell their cage is close or just wake up easily because I moved. I've had some that truly just preferred to be in their cage rather than on me.

I have two carmel boys that are still flight risks, I can see it in their eyes, and body language, and I don't push their boundaries to hard.

If they are on me, they are in my clothes and I'm hyper aware of where they are lol. I think of sweatshirts as big bonding bags and for the most part so do the gliders.

The biggest advantage I have is, the other gliders these two are caged with are ones that will stay on me no matter what, and the 2 boys don't stray to far from them. So I can focus on the boys n not worry about the others who don't usually wake up once they have settled in their spots.

Don't worry about still needing a tent, many people do for various reasons, a lot of times because of other pets roaming the house.

If mine get away from me, they aren't in any danger, this is super important to understand.

I live in a 5th wheel trailer everything is contained, there is no place they can go that i can't easily retrieve them from and there is no way they can get outside. Even my toilet isn't a risk to my gliders as it's not a traditional toilet that auto fills the toilet bowl with water. Most glider owners don't have that kind of security in their homes. Being that my house is so secure it allows me to be a lot more confident about it. Confidence is essential for handling gliders. If your always worried about where they might go.... the glider is going to be more skiddish. If your calm and not worried, the glider also feels calm on you.

The only reason I use a tent at all is because it's easier to "bond" in a confined space than it is in the wide open area and I want them focused on me, not everything else. I also can ignore them easier knowing they are safely confined and not getting into something they shouldn't.

So you see, there are many factors at play when you look at someone else and the bond they have with their gliders. And even though it seems my gliders are super "bonded" to me, that's only true for some of them and i have yet to say how long it's really taken to get where we are. And even those bonds I have with my guys, may not be as strong as someone else with their gliders.

There is one lady that I'm in awe of. She takes all her gliders outside and has them all clicker trained. They all glide to her on command, they do obstacle courses, she tosses them and they run right back to her.

It's amazinggggggggggg the bond she has with them and I can't imagine the time it truly takes to do that. It's incredible to watch, and it also freaks me out lol all i can think of is omggggggg and NOPE NOT HAPPENING I have done to much research and there is to much of a risk for picking up parasites!! lol

My point is, it's very easy to envy another persons "bond" without knowing all the details that helped them achieve that bond. Prime example

That ONE adorable picture of a glider sleeping in someones hand.


We see that adorable picture and have an instant awwwwwwwwwwww reaction and assume the glider is just really mellow and very socialized..... then we think..... I WANT THAT!

What you DON'T see or hear about is ........

that person might have taken 500 pictures that day to get that ONE adorable shot, it probably took multiple tries to get it, and that glider probably woke up and left that hand right after the picture was taken.

That person could have cupped the hand over the glider in the pouch while the glider was already asleep, then slowly inverted the pouch so that the glider was now in the hand. The second that glider realized it, went right back to the pouch. ( very plausible because I've done this myself just to see )

Out of my current 10 gliders I have 3 that will stay in my hand for more than a minute and two were born here and I've handled since before their eyes opened the third is 13 yrs old and is THE most socialized glider I've ever met whom I've only had for a couple weeks.


Don't worry bout where you are compared to someone else. Their environment is different, the gliders are different, the humans actions are different EVERYTHINGGGGGGGGG is different so there is no fair or equal comparison.

Be proud of what you have achieved no matter how little it seems to you it's not little at all, keep looking forward and celebrate all the new progress and milestones... that's all you can do

Update: just an update for those interested. It has been about a week since I placed the mannequin hand in the cage with my little guy. He runs to it when startled and even carries his food to it. Tonight I opened the cage door and stuck my hand in and left it there. Within seconds he climbed down the side in was on and sniffed and put one hand on mine for support as he checked me out. No biting!!!

I want to say this is a successful method, but it still may be too soon. Plus, I am the only one trying it. If you know someone struggling with biting during bonding, maybe it would be best to see if this works for them. Then maybe we can place this idea as a possible resolution. But I would say we need a few more trials.
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Thanks!

Also, I have a new cage coming as the one he arrived with is much too small. I grabbed the Brisbane cage from EN. This way he has plenty of room to play and room for a friend down the line.

Talk about timing. Caught him on the hand.

Update: So, I got my little a guy a nice new cage. (Brisbane) And, I filled it with some new goodies. He woke up to his new home and checked everything out. I did put the hand in the new cage. Within 3 hours or being in the new cage he came up to me at the front of the cage. As I adjusted a few things to make navigation easier, he made his way to my hand where he sniffed around, nibbled just a little and then climbed on. I wasnt even trying to touch him. He did this on his own. Then I pulled him out and pet him and put him back inside.(I'm sure he is still a flight risk. I spent some time with him and then went to bed as usual.

I woke up and greeted him, he was on his wheel most if the night. So I think this new enclosure has increased his overall happiness. Then I placed my hand in the cage formed as the fake one. He climbed right on and then I pulled him closer and he ran up my arm. I did pick him off and put him back on his cage where he ran around on the outside.

I think that my persistence in talking and spending time has played a great deal, but I do not think any of this would have happened so quickly if I hadn't put the hand in the cage with him


Thanks again for all of your input.

Awesome job prime example of finding what works for you and your gliders lol I'm sure it was a combination of several things but whatever the reasons, I'm glad to see your making progress and that it's working for you and him