As I mentioned before, I have a glider named Rockie (shes my rock star and when I take her out of her cage, she sometimes looks like she's having a seizure. I took her to the vet (of course) and she said it may be from a poor diet (b/c I only used to feed her the pellet sugar glider food and fruits) After that, I changed her diet to the BML diet, fruits, mealworms etc.However, she still has these "seizures". When I say that I mean, she will just freeze, start shaking, blinking, and drooling. I just hold and console her until it passes. But I don't know what to do. I want to take her out more, because I know she enjoys it, but I feel I'm endangering her. I don't know why she has them. Maybe they're "panic attacks" because she doesn't come out that often? But it seems like she has a ball when she's out; she runs around, jumps, plays, etc. I know to add even more protein to her diet now, but I really don't beleive that's just the reason. Just as people have "attacks" or "seizures" could that be the case with animals too? But what should I do? Try to take her out more to get her more accustomed to it? I don't want to never take her out!? I'm lost....

Honestly, I think you need to get a vet with a little more glider experience and get a second opinion. This does not sound healthy. Freezing and shaking isn't that uncommon. The drooling is definitely odd.

I've never heard of that before. I would definitely try to find another experienced exotic vet to see what you can find out. I know it's expensive but it could be something serious. The way you describe it is similar to a human having an epileptic seizure.

Also, how long has she been on the new diet? If it really is diet related (which I am skeptical of), has her diet been changed long enough to have made a difference?

Either way, I wouldn't wait to get a 2nd opinion. Better safe than sorry!

Awww poor baby If she is fine once she is out, I would say the initial excitement triggers the onset of a seizure. I have a son who has seizure disorder and yes emotional excitement can be a trigger.

Yes animals can be epileptic just as humans, there could be any number of things that are causing them or a combination of things, from poor diet to faulty brain waves.

Has she been tested for diabetes? How long have you been feeding the BML? Are you also feeding plenty of fresh fruits and veggies? What does your vet say?

Try slowly bringing her out to play by feeding her a treat such as a mealy then gradually take her out of the cage. Keep your excitement level down at first so she doesn't get overly excited.

But please be sure to get her back in to see the vet as this can be a serious problem.

Good luck and I hope everything works out for you and your baby.

Thank you everyone for your help and concern. I know, I really do need to get her into another vet. I thought it might be an anxiety thing, but the last time she was out, she continued to have them while she was out playing; so I'm not so sure anymore. I'll try to keep you updated

Just like humans, gliders can have seizures for a list of different reasons. This could be diet related, neurologic, or genetic....why is important, but her treatment for them is important too. I would call or contact Val or another rescuer with special needs gliders for advice. Her name here is Something_To_Believe_In. A glider's seizure is also not always what comes to mind when you think of the stereotypical human seizure, they don't necessarily flop on the floor. Sometimes it can be a frozen staring off into space, or just some shivering motions, or dropping their head....someone experienced with special needs gliders can better help you with special cage set-up and how to find the seizure triggers.

Good luck and yes please keep us posted.

I have dealt with seizures in my glider for years. I have done a ton of research on seizures in gliders and the SUGAR group has an ongoing seizure study.

A seizure in a glider can manifest in many different ways. They CAN have a seizure which includes the "shaking" movements you think of when you think of seizures - called clonic/tonic movements.

They can also have an absence seizure - which means that they freeze and stare off into space, but are unresponsive to you. Often, with absence seizures, they will also grip very strongly with their front hands, or clench them if on the ground/floor.

They can also have a combination of the two. Other signs that they might exhibit are foaming at the mouth or dropping to the floor and lying unresponsive.

There are also several reasons a glider might have a seizure, but it seems the most of the time they are related to hypoglycemia. This occurs when the glider's metabolism causes blood sugar to drop and the glider then becomes active, which leads to a hypoglycemic seizure. To eliminate this risk, give your gliders a treat in their pouch about 2 hours before they wake up and make sure that they have food in their cage before they wake up. Some have also tried an additional calcium supplement (under a vet's supervision). However, I have only heard of this doing any good to treat seizures in one case.

Gliders can also have neurologic seizures. For these, there is no way to safely treat them medically in gliders as any seizure medication would have to be monitored through frequent blood draws and most people are not willing to put their glider through that. The best way to treat neurologic seizures is to identify and eliminate or significantly decrease the trigger(s). For my glider, his trigger is stress or fatigue, so I am diligent about keeping stress to a very minimum and to limiting out of cage time to short periods.

Once a glider has a seizure, you must wait for the seizure to pass and then you can give a bit of kayro syrup as a licky treat, some food, and plenty of pedialyte to get electrolytes up. Do not try to give anything by mouth until the seizure has completely stopped.

Here is a photo of my Mocha in the midst of a seizure (to give you an idea of what they might look like)

I think all you can do is love her and keep her safe. Try to find something that might trigger these seizures. Maybe a certain fruit or snack, maybe a smell or purfume? I don't know.

I hope you can get her under control!

Margie

As always wonderful post Val.

My experience with seizures is not from gliders it is from one of the ferrets I have. The female will have a seizure if she does not wake up enough and eat enough. She has been known to sleep through a feeding and with her size it isnt good. I didnt know any of this until i expeiernced it myself with her. I did all vet work, research, etc. So I know what causes hers.

Defenatally talk with atleast 1 more vet, just like humans you sometimes want a 2nd opinion because they might know something the first one didnt.

Good luck on finding her trigger!!

Thank you, Val!!!

I have added this post to our Health Links thread.

I have seen this behavior present in possums but not any of my own glider zoo as yet. In the case of a particular possum, it has been diagnosed as a brain disorder from birth; probably a genetic flaw based on known inbreeding. The possum will freeze, head will go back with eyes open and it will typically have a little bit of hand/arm movement as if to grab hold of something. This lasts for ten to twenty seconds and occurs much less often than before. These moments are largely triggered by stress of a startle. So to avoid them is about the only thing to do for this one.

Gliders are generally known to be inbred/line bred and could easily suffer from all sorts of other non-genetic maladies to cause this issue. One thing I have been told is to try supplementing with VitK and Selenium to encourage neurological health. Some gliders have been found to be diabetic. My vet was able to "cure" or improve a diabetic glider with one of her customers by providing a very strict diet. A failing liver could cause these symptoms and this seems to be an increasing thing for gliders as they get on super high sugar diets with over supplementing.

It will be improbable for any vet to get blood enough for testing so the only real thing you can do is alter inputs and see what you get as a result. So definitely try diet. I would stick with real food, low sugar, no supplements for awhile and see what changes.

And there is the real inevitability that not everything is going to be fixable. Small creatures are awfully hard to diagnose so you just have to use what is known out in the community and wish for the best.

Thank you all so much! You know, and acutally in response to that last post...I got Rockie from a pet store in the city. She was kept in this tiny cage all by herself; I felt delighted to get her out of there and into my home. That was a couple of years ago. I never really knew about, like "sugar glider mills" or vendor or anything like that. But now that I'm thinking about it, that's probably where she came from; I would assume that a pet store would get their animals from sugar glider "mills" just as they might from puppy mills. I wonder if it's simply genetic from the inbreeding. Because my second glider Zoe I got from a wonderful breeder with whom I met with and loved her gliders to death. I think I should still take Rockie to a vet, but the more I think it over, the more probable this seems to me...What are your thoughts????

If they havent ever seen a vet, you might do that as an important step. It is good to be armed with some information to help. I recommend a bird/exotics vet or phone around and find someone with glider experience. I recommend looking very hard for parasites. You might even take a drop or two of Revolution to each sugar glider to be safe but I would isolate them separately for a night to let it work its magic before the group starts grooming on each other. Check for ear mites, collect poo for a fecal float, and bring in whatever info you can collect that can help diagnose.

Typically with a vet as with a doctor, if you dont ask, you wont get.

I have epilepsy, so I can tell you from personal experience what your glider is going through. First, she will feel confused and vulnerable. When I am about to have a seizure I want someone to comfort me and be near so that when it's over I feel safe. I usually have time to lie down prior to seizures, but emotionally, I need that comforting. Afterward, I am very drained and feel as if I've run a marathon. Also, I'm confused and have difficulty doing things afterward. If someone would cuddle me after a seizure, that would be perfect, but since I'm an adult I don't get that. LOL!

I also had a dog that had several seizures during his lifetime. I would comfort and cuddle him both during and after his seizures, and although he would be confused, he was happy and playful soon after. You can't always determine the cause of seizures, and in the case of small animals, you can't medicate them. All you can do is work with what you can and care for them.

P.S. After all these years and numerous tests, they have not found the cause of my seizures, so don't expect a vet to be able to diagnose something related to the brain of a sugar glider. We don't even know that much about human brains yet.

Good information Widdle. I would suggest that most people dont have much of an understanding about what it's like to go through seizures. The confused and vunerable things wouldnt have been on my list of thinking about that kind of stuff.

And you are never too adult to be cuddled...

Yes, good post widdle. I too, have epilepsy, although I've never experienced epilepsy in gliders. I'm sure that since a vet can prescribe anti-seizure medicine for dogs, that they could probably prescribe something for gliders too. Like others have said, once you pinpoint its triggers, it will make things a lot easier on you and your glider. Besides taking him to the vet, I think it'd be important to just spend a little extra time with Rockie. As stated before, the cuddling/emotional support makes a world of difference in humans, and I'm sure Rockie wouldn't mind it either.

Yes, very good advice, Widdle, Nicole. Thanks you guys. All that information is very comforting. Whenever she does go through a seizure, I make sure im holding her, tucking her close to my chest afterward so she does feel that comfort she needs. I love her so much, but I feel so helpless. Again, I don't know how much a vet can do, but she's absolutely worth the 2nd opinion from another doctor, and if there is something that can be prescribed...that'd be great.
You know, she seems to have them as soon as I take her out, or if her nails get caught on my clothes she will have one, so I thought it was initial stress of coming out of her cage. But the last time I had her out, she was running around having a ball and stopped mid-sprint and had one. Then she had a couple more in the midst of her playing. I cuddled with her until she was better, and finally put her back in her cage. I want her to come out more, spend more time with her, but I'm afraid I'm going to kill her!

Where do you live? I know a great vet in my area.
Dale

If your vet tries any medications with you to try to prevent the seizures, do let us know. That would be very interesting to follow.

Poor little Rockie, could it be something she eats regularly? I dont know much about epilepsy but I know some foods can trigger seizures or some foods she can eat more of that will help reduce the seizures. maybe you can find something that will help reduce the occurance of the seizures something maybe you can experiment on. I have complex migrane headaches very often that make the whole right side go completly numb and I cant look at any light and it feels like a train ran over my head, I have been to several hospitals for this and they all have taken many tests and nothing is nurlogicly wrong with my brain, They have taken blood tests so many times my arm is always black and blue from the IV. I have been able to find out that the certain foods I eat do cause me to get these headaches more than usual, and if I have a high salt intake for one day I will be fine for a couple days with no haedaches. I would try to do a little experiment with the foods you feed her maybe it can help, you can at least try. Good Luck I hope all goes well.

I'm in the Chicagoland area. Thanks for responding. I'm not sure about the foods. I try to switch it all up for her. I wasn't able to take her out last night b/c it got late and I knew she wouldn't want to be stuck in the bonding pouch. But I am going to try to tonight. I really think it's when she gets startled she has one. I try moving a lot more slowly so as not to frighten her. My poor baby :( I know the vet's office I normally go to has an exotic vet, I don't know how good/bad they are. I've got my fingers crossed...