We are just so sick of the twisted lies mill breeders tell and the equally twisted lies that (would you believe) an actual vet tells that we are compelled to publish a series of debunking videos on YouTube. The purpose of these videos is two-fold:

1. To establish that there are in fact a regular set of "Myths" or "Lies" told by mill breeders, and that apparently healthcare professionals can be duped into believing some of them and parroting what the greedy, soul-less mill breeders say.

2. To warn people about the truth of sugar gliders as pets so they don't buy or adopt them based on false information. If you buy or adopt sugar gliders based on false information, it only ends up hurting the animal or killing it.

Overview: Debunking Sugar Glider Mill Breeder Lies

Mill Breeder Lie Number 1 - "They are Teddy Bears"

Mill Breeder Lie 2 - Impulse Buy Venues OK

Mill Breeder Lie 3 - Gliders Get along with Dogs

Mill Breeder Lie 4 - Pellets are a Real Diet

Mill Breeder Lie 5 - You Can Potty Train Sugar Gliders

Mill Breeder Lie 6 - Sugar Gliders Don't Bite Deep

Mill Breeder Lie 7 - Sugar Gliders Thrive on being Alone

Mill Breeder Lie 8 - There are no legit Sugar Glider Rescues

Mill Breeder Lie 9 - Fake Product Review Sites

Mill Breeder Lie 10 - Heat Rocks are OK for Sugar Gliders

Thank God that you made these! I have been talking with others that we, those of us who actually care about gliders, need videos to combat ASGV and PPP videos. And here you come with exactly that! And backed up by your own research and proven methods, you sound much more legit then some self proclaimed president of a mythical association backed by a mill breeding corporation!

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Originally posted by filly47

Thank God that you made these! I have been talking with others that we, those of us who actually care about gliders, need videos to combat ASGV and PPP videos. And here you come with exactly that! And backed up by your own research and proven methods, you sound much more legit then some self proclaimed president of a mythical association backed by a mill breeding corporation!

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Amen, sister! ;)

Excellent videos, Ed!!!

Thank you! As one that was duped by the mills I am happy to see this information out there for others to see.

aww thank you so much! these are great!!! i agree with filly, i was also thinking about how we need to combat the stupid PPP and ASGV videos on youtube!!

these are awesome. :]

I have to watch these at home, but I'm so pleased someone has put some information on these sites, now we have a place to refer newbies if we are approached with questions about these myths.

With any luck this will help even 1 person do their research or not get one at all because of these videos, Thanks for posting

Thanks for posting these videos! Bookmarked! =)

Great job! I'm going to redirect everyone that posts on Dr. Brust's youtube account that say he is accurate lol

this is great! ed, would you mind if i put this on my facebook page? its a page against PPP, id love to share it with other owners.

LOL good videos.

I would have called out Dr.B himself, by name, on video and shown the direct link between ASGV and the mill. That information alone says it all!! Evil Bastards!!!


I'm curious if they are breaking the law with those videos and all the "fair practices" they practice. Ed do you have a good lawyer? I don't know how they would defend them selfs when its all on video.

Awesome videos. Thank you for posting these Lucky. If only one glider is saved then it was worth it to view. Hopefully many more will be saved with them. Education is power,the breeders thrive on people who are uneducated on these furry little fuzzbutts.

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Originally posted by guitargeek01

this is great! ed, would you mind if i put this on my facebook page? its a page against PPP, id love to share it with other owners.

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Of course go ahead and put it on your page. Observe; however, how I do not directly name a specific mill breeder or the specific name of any vet. I think the message comes across loud and clear tough.

If anyone wants to support this effort, please feel free to go to the YouTube page and leave comments. This will be very helpful.

Many thanks

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Originally posted by Catman

LOL good videos.

I would have called out Dr.B himself, by name, on video and shown the direct link between ASGV and the mill. That information alone says it all!! Evil Bastards!!!

I'm curious if they are breaking the law with those videos and all the "fair practices" they practice. Ed do you have a good lawyer? I don't know how they would defend them selfs when its all on video.

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Catman, I despise the people who exploit animals and who use inhumane practices. But if you'll notice, I am going out of my way to use examples and observations from the rescue to debunk what they are saying. I am not trying to be slanderous. I think if everyone is careful in this regard it will be easier for everyone to speak their mind.

Regarding ANY vet who parrots the sentiment of mill breeders, I say "shame on you." It is a very sad thing to take decent credentials and then corrupt them by selling out to the "dark side" and propagating their misleading lies.

For example, I try to say things like:

I do not agree with the practice of X because it hurts gliders or leads to their abandonment
or
Consider the motivation in saying X because it is misleading...
or
It is not humane to say X because we have proof it causes Y
or
We do not like what they do when they say X because it is not the full story and causes people to make a bad decision

There is nothing slanderous in these words. These are my opinions based on our careful observations.

Regarding the silly and transparent web and fictitious name registrations done by mill breeders,
take a look at the comments on one of the videos from "sweetness7969" and my replies…. www.youtube.com/watch?v=yzb04tn2vfQ

Would love for all of you to go there and add your own comments please

Here is what I say after she called me a "PETA conspiracy theorist"

My response:

"Oh Yeah? Docs from the Fla Dept of State - Div. of Corporations clearly show a submittal and withdrawals of the fictitious name registration of Association of Sugar Glider Veterinarians. Docs clearly show the name, title + signature of a well-known sugar glider mill breeder. ASGV appears again in web domain registries as being applied for by "Domains By Proxy" which is how pornographers and other undesirables attempt hide their identity when applying for domain names. Conspiracy? Huh!"

So as you can see I do reveal a little about what is going on behind the scenes but I don't use any names and I simply refer to public records.

In fact, I have the downloaded documents from the state of FLA as anyone can.

Interestingly, the documents show a telling timeline and I think you can all go there and check it out yourself (search the database for the Association of Sugar Glider Veterinarians as a fictitious name registration).

Anyway, the first registration was made by a company which is the holding company for a mill breeder. I think you can figure out who it is.

Some time later, one of the owners of that same company submits paperwork saying the first registration was fraudulent (yeah like someone thought up the name of that org and tagged it to them all by themselves - right) and withdrew it.

Then, all of the sudden, the domain registration happens under the shadowy cloak of the dirtball-hiding "domains by proxy" scam. Only low-lifes who want to hide their identity use proxy services when registering domains. Why would the good doctor himself have hid HIS name if in fact HE were the one to apply for that domain name? Huh? Well, the answer is if he were the one to have created it he would have had no motivation to skulk behind the facade of the dirt-ball-hiding "Domains by Proxy."

Who in fact would be motivated to hide their name? Well, the ones perhaps who denied they were the ones to have filed for the fictitious name in the first place? Maybe?

Hmm, sounds like similar practices as with the original FAKE .org sites that all cross link back to a mill breeder page and have text where the wording and syntax is exactly the same...

Hmm, sound like similar practices as with the FAKE so-called product review site that lavishes strong praise a mill breeder but says bad stuff about GG and a legit non-profit rescue. Yes, the same site that gives you fake "due to internet spam" rationale for not allowing you to leave your own product reviews.

It's all very transparent, seamy, stuff. Too bad these obvious, fake tactics dupe so many people.

Mill Breeders and criminals seem to share certain characteristics. Based on these observations it not too much of a stretch of the imagination to conclude they both lie and mislead and scam a lot. And they both assume that EVERYONE is stupid and they are so sly and smart. Do you get that impression?

Please go to LuckyGliderRescue at YouTube to weigh in with your comments on the debunking series

I am not currently registered for youtube to leave a feedback comment, but I will in the next few days! However, as a scientist I can say to that person just how incorrect and corrupt the data is. To the untrained eye it all looks legit, but to someone versed in the actual scientific method I can say how they have twisted their data sets in favor of supporting their own beliefs. None of their research is published in a legit scientific magazine, and is not up for critic by the scientific community. I don't care if the vet is a specialized exotic vet-clearly he has been bought out by a company, and as thus has comprimised his code to promote the health and general well being of those animals under his care. Just as a human doctor can be bought out by major drug companies and comprise the health of their patients by pushing dangerous drugs on them and lying to them about the benefits and hazards to pocket the money from the drug company. It is very clear that the domains are owned by the same people (darrenmccall.com/blog/2009/12/11/perfect-pocket-pets/) and that the vet is promoting the same products.

Now Ed, I respect your research and study on sugar gliders. You are very knowledgable in their nutrition and have no outward motivation to obscure any data in one favor. Though I do not know your methods and can not say that your data is scientifically verified through dozens of rigorous tests, I do know that your observations are proof enough. The gliders on your diet have a healthier coat as well as increased energy and overall health. The fact that you do not sell anything and are a non profit who generates these videos and free recipes to your 'secret' glider soup should be obvious to all that you are in this 'business' because you honestly care about gliders, not because you want to make a profit!

filly47, thank you for your comments. No the LGRS suggie soup has not undergone rigourous scientific testing. We have not been able to scare up enough donations to pursue that but I'd like to participate in a study that anyone undertakes. Unfortunately, the testing we seek is usually sponsored by pet chow companies and they usually don't embark on the expense until the popularity of a certain pet has reached "critical mass."

We barely get enough donations to keep the rescue running let alone our more lofty goals of creating a universal, easy-to-prepare meal for gliders. We have even consulted with experts on canning and freeze drying but were quickly humbled at the quotes we got...

However, in the spirit of scientific openness and transparency, we do in fact publish the nutritional analysis. And, we do make improvements to it over time.

Our own research has in fact been expensive. We have purchased many academic journals, field studies and books on marsupial nutrition. We also pay dearly for our USDA veterinary care program vet, who including non-profit discounts, charges hundreds of dollars for a site visit. We take full advantage of those visits and of course our visits to get surgeries, stool floats, blood work and health checks done on incoming rescues. We were very careful in our selection of this vet. She is triple-degreed, with a degree in chemistry, a masters in biochemistry and nutrition, and of course the DVM. We have shared with her the results of the diet and she has witnessed first-hand the "before and after" effects of it. We are honored that considering her education and expertise in sugar gliders, she refers people to us for our dietary workshop (Gail teaches it).

If you are aware of a university program or other academic initiative in which they seek a non-profit partner to do further research on glider nutrition, please let us know and we will contact them.

Many thanks!

P.S. I just posted another "MILL BREEDER LIE" VIDEO which I will post here and in a separate thread:


Mill Breeder Lie 9: FRAUD! [Address of Banned Product Review Site]

for those of you who have not seen it, we added LIE #10 on heat rocks. I edited the original link up above here....

Ed, thank you so much for doing what none of us have done. We need these videos out there and you took the time to do them. Bravo to you!

Yes bravo Ed!!! This is something we definately have needed for a long time.

Thank you all. Please make sure you post comments on the vids on YouTube and point people to them

so far i have only watched the biting video but will watch the others as soon as im not babysitting. but i was was reading a comment in a sugar glider facebook group and a person said this to a person who's sugar glider is bitting all the time and yes she got it from pocket pets. "When mine bit, I put my thumb in his mouth (nail side down so it doesn't hurt or you could put a bandaide around it if he has long teeth) to let him know it doesn't bother me. Some say to keep it in for at least 5 minutes (which feel like forever) so that they learn their lesson. I've never had to keep it in there long for him to get the picture... See More. I would then use positive reinforcement (usually a combination of petting and food like likables or papaya) when he wasn't biting and always before the interaction was finished. He almost never bites now and when he does, it is usually an accident"
i wanted to know if this is another lie and if its bad for the gliders to do this. she also said she heard some people use yuck-e-stuff to get gliders to stop biting is this too another lie? she put a link to ppp site where they sell the yuck-e-stuff. im currently trying my best to help the person who is having the glider that bites and get her on the right track and also gave her a link to this site. but im afraid if i show her your video on biting it will discourage her from working with her glider and scare her. do you have any advice for her?

We get those two questions all the time and I just posted the answers in our blog:

Here are some answers to two most commonly asked questions about dealing with sugar gliders who bite:

Q. Can't you just jam your finger in their mouth to discourage biting?

Q. Can't you just spray some magical sauce on things that makes them not bite?

The short answer is please don't do either...

We tried that whole 'stick your finger in their mouth' thing when we were new to sugar gliders and even before we started the rescue operation we found it was a less than optimal approach. There are serious problems with this approach so I don't recommend it. The biggest problems:

1. It scares them and therefore does not promote trust.

2. If you put your finger in and a tooth gets caught on it and you yank your finger out, you could break a tooth or possibly even the glider's neck

3. Glider bites can be dangerous. Their mouths are a veritable cauldron of bacteria. no sense asking for a deep bite.

4. Some gliders are just biters and you have to live with it if they are.

5. Don't spray any chemicals or miracle cures on things to keep them from biting. You can't trust the ingredients most of the time and most people say it doesn't work anyway.

Here's what does work:

1. No "Hand of God" at First

For scared or bitey gliders, don't stick your hand in their pouch to grab them. Lure them out with a treat or dump them out of the pouch and let them run around. They are less likely to bite you when they are out and about. Eventually, if you announce yourself first and they know you're coming, you can put your hand in.

2. Distractions Work

If they bite, you can distract them with a feather or treat

3. Back of Hand, not fingers

Offer them the back of your hand if you want them to get close to you. If you point your fingers out, they may bite the ends of the finger thinking you are giving them a treat. So don't give them fingers at first unless you have a treat. back of hand so they jump on back of hand instead.

4. Simulate Pouch

If you can't cup them in your hand because they bite, hold them tummy-down against your chest or stomach so their head is pointing down and can't bite you. Apply enough pressure at first to keep them from twisting their head around. Slowly let go and if they scurry away, let them. Repeat. Gliders like to crawl FORWARD generally, so take advantage of that and offer back of hand, back of hand (other one), back of hand (other one) and then cup free hand on top, transfer to chest, etc.

5. Thumb Under Chin Trick

As in the "How to give oral meds to sugar gliders" video on the LuckyGliderRescue YouTube channel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhDWBeGqcqY

You can hold them tummy-down against your chest and work your thumb up underneath their chin while SUPPORTING the back of their head so you can inspect them, stroke them, etc. without being bit.

6. Stinky Fleece Burrito

Wrap them in a fleece that is part of their (stinky) bedding to calm them. Slip a finger or two under the fleece to gently stroke them, but keep a bunch of fleece bulked-up around their head to discourage biting.

7. Accept Affection as they Give it

Some gliders hate being held and the best you'll get is they run up to you, playfully nip you or steal a treat and run away. Deal with it. That's the kind of "love" some gliders give to run up, do something and then run away. The fact they are coming up to you on their own is a good thing. Just sit there and let them run around and let them COME TO YOU, not the other way around.

Now here is the plain truth:

- Some gliders are all snuggly-wuggly and like to be affectionate and hang with you and sit in your hand and be stroked

- Gliders all have their own personality. Some bite and that's just reality. Try to distract them and give them some space and they will bite less. But if they are a biter, they are a biter.

- Learn to love that personality for what it is. Don't expect each glider to be a docile teddy bear.

thank you so much! this should help alot. ill send her the link right away.

Bumpybumpbump.